[ShaneWalsh]

Michonne and Andrea scene very sad i almost cry.

[theriderone7]

The Govnah has gone full psycho. I loved it and I eagerly await his role in season 4, if he has one.

I don't think it was anticlimatic at all. It was full of suspense, drama and just the right amount of action. I think people have been spoiled by Mazzara's 24/7 balls to the walls action and zombie killing. I am glad that the show is finally showing some restraint. KIlling zombies and violence is part of life, but from a story perspective you take away all the excitement if you use it way too much. It's why I think many people aren't all that fazed by Andrea's death. Mazzara has killed so many character from the very start of the season the shock value has worn off.

Tyreese still can't shoot for shit.

I await season 4 with great anticipation. I didn't think it was possible, but the last five episodes have completely turned my opinion around. I was sure I wasn't going to be back for the next

1) TG going full psycho felt more forced to me than anything.

2) People weren't fazed by Andrea's death because it was completely unbelievable. It has nothing to do with excessive zombie killing.

3) Tyreese can't shoot for shit? Maggie and Glen were firing fully automatic weapons into a crowd of at least 20 people while controlling the high ground of the battle field and didn't even scratch anyone. That probably creates a better image of not being able to shoot.

4) While I will watch season 4, I'm not eagerly awaiting it. I expect I'll catch a commercial for it about a week before it comes on and think "Hmm...It's October already?"

[theriderone7]

Is it ridiculous to think they were just trying to scare them off? I.e. that they were deliberately not trying to hit anyone until/unless they had to? I wonder if maybe they figured these are just regular people, not hardened soldiers, who will run away as soon as bullets start flying. If that's the case, the plan may have been to intentionally avoid killing them and just scare them off. That wasn't really made clear, but it seems consistent with the philosophy of team prison - Hershel specifically. He's always going to advocate any alternative to killing.

I think it is a little far fetched to believe that they were just trying to scare them off. These same regular people stood in a big circle yelling "kill! kill!" when TG had Merle and Daryl pitted against each other. If they're sadistic enough to watch and cheer for a fight to the death in the walker cage, they're sadistic enough to intend death on the prison team. This is about all that the prison team knows about these people. I personally would have been purposely mowing down as many as I could. They're obviously committed enough to attack once. It makes little sense to try to scare off a group of perceivably sadistic people just so they can regroup and try again.

[theriderone7]

I think it's odd that people have this certain expectation that a season finale has to be [whatever]. It has to have a giant battle, or some specific dramatic conclusion, or wrap up everything from the whole season, etc. Isn't it more interesting when expectations are inverted and it's NOT a cookie cutter finale? Don't get me wrong, I agree there were some flaws, but I am SOOOOO glad TG is still around. It would be unthinkable to develop such a great role and then not have him back for another season. One of my favorite season finales was season 1 of LOST (I believe it's season 1), where they find the hatch and the season ends without anyone finding out what's inside. You just know there's a mystery waiting to be unfolded the next season. This is a bit like that - we know TG is still out there but have no idea what he's planning, where he's going, etc. All we know is that he's more of a psychopath than ever and that's not going to be pleasant for Rick, Michonne, etc next season while he's running around in the woods (or whatever it is).

I don't think anyone here thinks this episode was supposed to tie up all loose ends, but when the show's producers/writers/advertisers lead you to believe that the final episode will be packed with drama and excitement and sorrow and conflict and shock, it stands to reason that they should deliver on their perceived promise.

Also, a final scene (or few scenes) that leave you thinking "Whoa! What happens next?!?" would add some encouragement to return next season. Instead, a large majority of people are on this forum asking "Why should I come back again?"

TG running away without some kind of final scene of his angry, determined face obviously doesn't leave most of us wondering "Ooooh, what's he gonna do next?" Clearly most people are left scratching their heads with a feeling of "uh, what?"

[That Guy]

1) TG going full psycho felt more forced to me than anything.

2) People weren't fazed by Andrea's death because it was completely unbelievable. It has nothing to do with excessive zombie killing.

3) Tyreese can't shoot for shit? Maggie and Glen were firing fully automatic weapons into a crowd of at least 20 people while controlling the high ground of the battle field and didn't even scratch anyone. That probably creates a better image of not being able to shoot.

4) While I will watch season 4, I'm not eagerly awaiting it. I expect I'll catch a commercial for it about a week before it comes on and think "Hmm...It's October already?"

1) Totally believable to me. The man has a god complex. He fancies himself above everyone else and they should do as he says. Then all of a sudden they don't listen to him anymore? Yeah, he's gonna go apeshit on 'em.

2) Elaborate. When I discuss something, I like a reason given, not just a "no, you're wrong and I'm right" kinda response.

3) They weren't trying to kill the Woodburians per se. Remember what Michonne said? "All you have to do is to make taking the prison more trouble than it's worth." Paraphrasing of course. And that's exactly what they did. They couldn't hit Tyreese and Sasha because they were completely behind cover, while Tyreese had Rick right in his crosshairs while he wasn't being shot at and still missed.

4) That's your perogative. It's a matter of opinion whether or not you're excited for the fourth season or not.

[mike3764]

I think her death illustrates a fundamental point - in this world, you can't save everyone. The people who survive are the ones who understand that. People who try to make peace, who try to "do the right thing" like Andrea, aren't long for this world. It was morally right for her to try to save everyone and make peace, but this world is no longer about morals. Pair that up with Carl - yeah, maybe the kid was actually trying to hand over his gun, but why risk it? Those are the people who survive - the ones who do things that might be morally wrong, but keep you alive. Goes right along with a major theme from the comic book - initially Rick's morality was, "you kill, you die" (i.e. if you're in his group and kill someone, YOU die) and eventually he realized the truth was - you kill, you live.

Absolutely - proves Morgan to be an amatuer prophet from what he told Rick a few episodes ago.

[herschelwalker]

Poor episode overall. Story arc with the Governor unresolved. The assault on the prison was a joke — if the Prison doesn’t take at least 1/3 of the attackers out in that ambush, its a total failure. Glenn and Maggie didn’t hit anyone.

Then Rick leads a reckless charge after the Governor’s people. Rick brings only three of his group. Even if Woodbury was routed, its not clear what Rick could hope to accomplish, especially since his actual ambush (which was successful), didn’t actual manage to tear up the Woodbury force at all.

The Governor’s “snapping” moment really wasn’t credible. He single-handedly guns down 30 people (all of whom are armed?) Really? No-one shoots back? He doesn’t miss any? None run away? And he does it because, they were ambushed in the prison and managed to get out without suffering any casualties?

Rick then decides to lead his skeleton force directly against the Woodbury gates. He doesn’t try to sneak around; doesn’t try to infiltrate the place. Instead, he walks right into a sniper ambush — putting his people at risk. Thankfully Tyreese is a terrible shot.

This show depends on people doing stupid things over and over again. And when people start to act like they have a brain, the show wrings its hands over the moral implications.

BTW — Carl’s shooting of the kid was entirely justified — being told to drop your weapon, and continuing to advance is a no-no. The Woodbury teenager saw 1) a cripple; 2) a girl holding a baby; and, 3) a child. The teen had a shotgun. No time to take chances.

[M-88]

Poor episode overall. Story arc with the Governor unresolved. The assault on the prison was a joke — if the Prison doesn’t take at least 1/3 of the attackers out in that ambush, its a total failure. Glenn and Maggie didn’t hit anyone.

Then Rick leads a reckless charge after the Governor’s people. Rick brings only three of his group. Even if Woodbury was routed, its not clear what Rick could hope to accomplish, especially since his actual ambush (which was successful), didn’t actual manage to tear up the Woodbury force at all.

The Governor’s “snapping” moment really wasn’t credible. He single-handedly guns down 30 people (all of whom are armed?) Really? No-one shoots back? He doesn’t miss any? None run away? And he does it because, they were ambushed in the prison and managed to get out without suffering any casualties?

Rick then decides to lead his skeleton force directly against the Woodbury gates. He doesn’t try to sneak around; doesn’t try to infiltrate the place. Instead, he walks right into a sniper ambush — putting his people at risk. Thankfully Tyreese is a terrible shot.

This show depends on people doing stupid things over and over again. And when people start to act like they have a brain, the show wrings its hands over the moral implications.

BTW — Carl’s shooting of the kid was entirely justified — being told to drop your weapon, and continuing to advance is a no-no. The Woodbury teenager saw 1) a cripple; 2) a girl holding a baby; and, 3) a child. The teen had a shotgun. No time to take chances.

TG gunning down his people is completely believable and reasonable to me. Remember, they're all sheep and they do not think he is a bad person (or at least before that)

[General Ian Zane]

Having not read the comic, and having seen all season that the people of woodbury were sheltered, the failed assault on the prison, plus the governors reaction to his charges, felt powerful and effective to me. (the people moving to the prison , and Tyrese being converted by one survivor, maybe not so much.)

In any case I enjoyed the show and enjoyed season 3.
Miss Holden had some apocalyptic bad luck with the writing of her character but hopefully this experience will give her career a nice boost.

show continues to struggle a bit with the ensemble format, where as season 1 seemed so effective. not sure what changed between 1 and 2.

but i aint gonna beg.

overall, very satisfied.

[AngryKoala]

I dont really care about Andrea dying, since the writers really messed her up and made her a very unlikeable annoying character. (which is apparently the opposite of the comic book version)

I do feel bad for Laurie Holden though. She just did what she had to do and got hatemail and death threats for it. And then she gets killed on the show. Very sad.

[Macilly]

I thought it was a poor episode.

If you are going to kill off Andrea why not do it in a more meaningful way? She and Milton are talking and she isn't even trying all that hard to get free till he tells her to hurry! It would have been better if there weren't pliers there and she had no hope of escape. The dialogue between them could have been powerful knowing he was going to kill her when he turned. The question of 'why did you stay' could have really meant something. It is beyond belief that she could not kill one walker when she was free and had a weapon - she did it all season!! And to be bit on the neck - ridiculous! Maybe the hand but he wouldn't have gotten that close to her to bite her neck!

I agreed with Carl 100% and was cheering when he bitch-slapped Rick with the truth. Jody should have dropped the weapon and he didn't. Hershel really got on my nerves when he told Rick that Carl took him down for no reason - UNTRUE! If he had dropped the gun and Carl shot him anyway - OK, but that is not what happened.

It may be only me but Rick has gotten on my last nerve since Lori died. I don't see him as much of a leader especially when he is wandering in the woods and barely even noticing Judith. I think it's ridiculous that he brought all those people over from Woodbury, who have been living with hot water/food/picnics/apartments, to the prison. Those people will be HATING it pretty quickly. Can you imagine Carl talking with these other boys his age who haven't even shot a gun, or took "point". Yeah - don't think he will be interested in mingling with them too much.

All around - poorly written episode. I can't get by Maggie/Glenn shooting and not ONE person from WB gets hit. These people just used rocket launchers on your prison so I don't buy the 'purposely missing' theory either. So much good material that was used so poorly.

[Undead Flesh]

A member on here who has very passionately been rooting for Andrea since the beginning.

Thank you

[Valleyaggie]

Okay. So I'm going to be extremely un-popular for a while.

I really, really liked it. I feel that Season 3 is about character development and this episode showed us exactly where everyone is.

1) Rick lost his way at the farm and the end of Season 2. He let Shane get into his head and declared the Ricktatorship. All of his guilt about Lori and the journey into crazytown were because Rick had lost his moral compass.

So Rick got his conscience back, and therefore got over seeing Lori. Seeing her was at least partially rooted in him feeling like he was doing the wrong thing, and doing it anyway. When he quit going against his conscience, he quit seeing her. Interesting how he is warming back up again, while Carl is growing colder.

Rick's conversation with Carl was the final block of sanity falling into place. Yes, Rick let Andrew go. Yes, Rick didn't kill the Governer when they were in the meeting alone. Rick made the morally correct choice. If you say that Andrew couldn't have been the cause of Lori and T-dog's deaths, or TG continuing to attack and kill were because of Rick's decision, I believe you are incorrect. Rick let them go because "We don't kill the living." Andrew and TG made the decisions to do what they did. A doctor who saves the life of a boy who grows up to be a serial killer isn't responsible for the choices the killer made. The only choices you are responsible for are your own and if you let someone's potential for evil dictate your choices, you are becoming as evil as they are.

2) Andrea. I believe Andrea's death to be completely in character and representative of the choices she made all season. I'm sorry if the comic readers are angry about her character development in the show, but this isn't the comics. Andrea struggled all during season 2 to find her balance. She never did. She continued to struggle in season 3. She wanted everything to be okay, everyone to be peaceful, to find a way for no one to die and everyone to live. Although she was a badass fighter against walkers, she always hesitated and second-guessed herself against the living. She was cuffed to the chair and even though Milton urged her to hurry, she could not accept the change in Milton from living to walker. She kept hesitating, clinging to the hope that Milton wouldn't die and she wouldn't have to "kill" him. She should have hurried more but again, that's not Andrea's MO. This time it cost her.

3) Milton's death. TG's move against Milton was so amazingly awful. "I said you're not leaving this room until you kill her." Soooo diabolical.

4) TG's shooting of his own people. TG is completely insane. We knew that in the last episode. He no longer cares about the Woodburians at all, except as tools. When his tools were turning against him, he killed them. He didn't go back to Woodbury because he doesn't care about it anymore. As for leaving him alive, he's still a huge threat. Guerrilla warfare can be very effective and that's the kind of campaign he is going to use. As for Martinez and the other guy, yes, they should have killed TG when they had the chance. But they are soliders, the kind that take orders and don't think about it. They were shocked but they will continue to follow him because that is the kind of people they are; they are like the unquestioning German soldiers in WWII who followed orders and hid behind that excuse.

5) Why did Maggie and Glenn not shoot people? It was said in another post that they were just trying to be enough of a pain in the ass to make it not worth it. They weren't trying to kill.

6) Why go back to the prison and not stay in Woodbury? Totally symbolic. Woodbury is TG's creation = evil. The prison is Rick and Co.'s haven = good.

This episode shocked the hell out of me and made me cry. Isn't that what it is supposed to do? We can't be shocked or cry if only good things happen to the people we like or the bad guy meets the predictable bad end at the hands of the noble good guy. If you want those kinds of things, watch old Westerns. The Lone Ranger always captures Black Bart, kisses the girl and rides off into the sunset with Tonto at his side.....

[Things&Stuff]

You really can't argue opinions, everyone has one. All we can do is analyze, share and respect. We all obviously enjoy the same material for the most part despite our discrepancies, but that's what makes individual taste so interesting.

To be fair, that's a pretty horrible example considering The Walking Dead was 2012's top selling comic.

http://bigstory.ap.o...p-selling-comic

Just saying.

That's fair. I just don't see that everywhere I go like I seem to the television series.

I won't ever read them now as it seems to just upset everyone who has. I feel terrible for all the anger and hate this show seems to generate. With all the real suffering in the world, why would anyone put themselves through this?

[Things&Stuff]

I felt a Michonne Rick vibe in Clear, I felt it again tonite. I'm not a shipper but I can't be the only one who felt it.

---didn't feel it in Clear but did pick up on it last night.

---I love when Yvette Nicole Brown is on Talking Dead, you can tell she's a true fan, she's always prepared. She should be a permanent guest.

Yes. I caught it in both episodes, too. I'm not a shipper, I am okay with whatever they give us and I will watch as long as I find it entertaining.

Did you see the Talking Dead? Reedus pointed out a scene where Rick followed Michonne with his eyes. Andy Lincoln gets into his character very deeply. Sarah Wayne Callies said she made a point of connecting with Andy after he'd filmed the scene where he finds out Lori is dead because 'when he goes down the rabbit hole, he goes all the way down'. Nuances in his acting are indications of where his character is going at the time of the shoot. So a look from him is, to me, more indication than one from Rooker or Scott Wilson. I'm not going to chart any course by what Norman Reedus said, but I think it's a fun little tidbit.

[Things&Stuff]

Okay. So I'm going to be extremely un-popular for a while.
Rick's conversation with Carl was the final block of sanity falling into place. Yes, Rick let Andrew go. Yes, Rick didn't kill the Governer when they were in the meeting alone. Rick made the morally correct choice. If you say that Andrew couldn't have been the cause of Lori and T-dog's deaths, or TG continuing to attack and kill were because of Rick's decision, I believe you are incorrect. Rick let them go because "We don't kill the living." Andrew and TG made the decisions to do what they did. A doctor who saves the life of a boy who grows up to be a serial killer isn't responsible for the choices the killer made. The only choices you are responsible for are your own and if you let someone's potential for evil dictate your choices, you are becoming as evil as they are.

I think that's a very important distinction and one that Rick needed to realize and did, finally.

2) Andrea. I believe Andrea's death to be completely in character and representative of the choices she made all season. I'm sorry if the comic readers are angry about her character development in the show, but this isn't the comics. Andrea struggled all during season 2 to find her balance. She never did. She continued to struggle in season 3. She wanted everything to be okay, everyone to be peaceful, to find a way for no one to die and everyone to live. Although she was a badass fighter against walkers, she always hesitated and second-guessed herself against the living. She was cuffed to the chair and even though Milton urged her to hurry, she could not accept the change in Milton from living to walker. She kept hesitating, clinging to the hope that Milton wouldn't die and she wouldn't have to "kill" him. She should have hurried more but again, that's not Andrea's MO. This time it cost her.

I really like how you worded this. You clarify what I've been feeling about Andrea. I don't think her death was meaningless or pointless in any way. She was far ahead of Rick and everyone else in realizing that you still have to trust and, like most 'pioneers' she didn't have enough information to make 100% good choices. Just because she died for her beliefs doesn't mean that she was a failure.

3) Milton's death. TG's move against Milton was so amazingly awful. "I said you're not leaving this room until you kill her." Soooo diabolical.

That scene took my breath away. This was very personal, very cruel and very calculated. That man's cheese not only slid off his cracker, it's not even on the plate anymore.

5) Why did Maggie and Glenn not shoot people? It was said in another post that they were just trying to be enough of a pain in the ass to make it not worth it. They weren't trying to kill.

Agreed. And if they had, they'd be no better than the Governor.

This episode shocked the hell out of me and made me cry. Isn't that what it is supposed to do? We can't be shocked or cry if only good things happen to the people we like or the bad guy meets the predictable bad end at the hands of the noble good guy. If you want those kinds of things, watch old Westerns. The Lone Ranger always captures Black Bart, kisses the girl and rides off into the sunset with Tonto at his side.....

Same here. When I was a kid it always sounded so cool to think of eating nothing but candy. Somehow now that I'm all grown up, it doesn't sound as good.

I watch this for the characters and to see how they 'help each other through this mess' to quote Andrea. This episode delivered.

Laurie Holden and Dallas Roberts should get recognized for their work in this episode. If the Emmies weren't a big popularity contest among Hollywood elites, they would. Maybe Golden Globes?

[Zprime]

Im one who never read the comic and am known as the walking dead guys with those i know. So me saying the s3 ending kinda fell flat has impact. I felt it when tdawg and lori died. I ran with rick after andrew cause to me i loved that part and many others even in s3 which seemed to really pingpong back and forth. I like zombies/biters/walkers/whatever. However the thing about this show (and im not coming off the whole the world is ending vibe and the show will be a horrible failure stance as others seem to be leaning) is that it hits the mark along quite a few lines but then just lands a shy scant distance from being totally badass. Thats what gets me so up in arms sometimes. They got all the resources to bring to tv such a great product that it keeps falling just to the right of the mark. Sooooo damn close but never fully ringing the gong.

And not being into this weeks slang that will vanish just as quick but whats this whole shipper nonsense im seeing?

[Steph]

And not being into this weeks slang that will vanish just as quick but whats this whole shipper nonsense im seeing?

Shipping is when people want two characters in a relationship. So when you hear someone say "I'm not usually a shipper", they mean that. Some people here are shipping Rick and Michonne, meaning they want Rick and Michonne in a relationship.

[That Guy]

Shipping is when people want two characters in a relationship. So when you hear someone say "I'm not usually a shipper", they mean that. Some people here are shipping Rick and Michonne, meaning they want Rick and Michonne in a relationship.

And when that relationship doesn't happen, they write erotic fanfiction about it.

[Steph]

And when that relationship doesn't happen, they write erotic fanfiction about it.

Oh please don't remind me. I've stumbled upon some truly horrifying fan fics in my time.

[Jayne23]

I liked season 3 so much better than season 2 just as it seemed more on track
and we was finally done with that whole triangle thing of love.
at least if rick gets into something (shipper ??) with michoone she will be cool
and not be acting like the queen bee. Lori just always seemed to have opinion and criticizm for rick
but that was then....
I also think michoone will help with carl a bit since it seems that he trusts her.
funny how everyone thought so bad about carl killing jody but not much talk ever
about michoone slicing the poor hermit in the woods.....

[Valleyaggie]

.
funny how everyone thought so bad about carl killing jody but not much talk ever
about michoone slicing the poor hermit in the woods.....

Poor hermit in the woods was batshit crazy (rooming with a dead dog? "That smell! It's loud!") and about to get them all killed. They were calmly telling him to be still and quiet and he did not do as instructed. He was a threat to all of them.

Jody was doing as instructed: lowering and turning over his gun and surrendering. Jody was no threat. Huge difference.

[Things&Stuff]

I wasn't posting here when that episode aired so I don't know if anyone else thought this but, Wouldn't the dog's smell hide the human just as much as walker guts? I know he was acting crazy in that moment but I'm wondering how much his act was a camouflage like the dog's smell?

This show is annoying like that.

[Tay]

People are getting the wrong idea. Just because most complained about Andrea, doesn't mean we wanted her killed off. Everybody wanted her to become like the badass she was supposed to be. But instead she was poorly written, and this finale makes her look even worse. She had plenty of time to free herself, but she wants to have conversations with a guy who's basically dead already. Am I supposed to feel bad for her because she took her sweet time? No. It is probably the worst death of the series so far, and I wish it didn't happen, because I liked the finale, and I think it's a good decision to bring back the Governor, and possibly assemble a new army.

[pitdawg1]

So anyone wonder if they took all the supplies from Woodbury? The weapons from the roadside massacre ? The .50 cal??