Character Trade, Living For Dead

- - - - - Rick Daryl Michonne Andrea T-Dog

#26
aces07301

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Bring back Andrea, kill Beth

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#27
UltraAmbiguousID

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Milton, I think he could have added a lot to the story arc.


I miss the actor and would have liked to see his character fit in with the prison group. His character arc would have been interesting! He also could have made some cool survival gadgets.
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#28
NAGILLUM

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I'm probably in the minority, but I felt that Merle's story had played out. He did add a great dynamic to the show but I'm not sure how much more he would have added to the story. I don't think we would be having this discussion, though, if they hadn't made Daryl so perfect now. He was so much more interesting as a flawed character.


Well for me, I still thought Merle had more to offer. Here's the thing with why I think Merle should've lived over Daryl. It's like you said, Daryl is too perfect now and I don't care to see his relationship with Carol progress because I don't really see it as much as everyone else does, every characters personality had a 180 during the time skips, we didn't see Daryl and Carol become close, it just happened between Seasons 2 and 3, he practically blew her off all the time by the end of Season 2 and then they're all chummy chummy by the beginning of Season 3.

The Dixon bros are a dynamic duo, the most well thought out of any TV introduced characters. I'll give them credit for that. But Merle was missing for a good time and we didn't see him progress as much by the time Season 3 came, it's like I said, a 180 in personality. He was a bit of a different Merle in Season 3 as opposed to Season 1. We already saw Daryl deal with losing Merle, on a technical scale. We didn't know Merle was dead, but we didn't know he was alive either. I thought Merle should have lived over Daryl because it would been interesting to see Merle deal with losing Daryl.

We are just getting the same thing over again, Daryl having to grow and prosper with out Merle and it's boring. We've already seen it! Merle, the one handed badass searching for the Governor would have been compelling and interesting. We could also see him develop a friendship with Michonne while they both search for the Gov. Daryl's just a poster boy now, he's not interesting to me at all anymore. Daryl's death could've served as a catalyst for another interesting character to take his spot, Merle. And then we wouldn't have people complaining about AMC cashing out for keeping Daryl around.
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Change is the law of life. And those who look only to the past, or the present, are certain to miss the future.

#29
Judari

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Merle, T-Dog, or Andrea survives for Beth or Maggie's demise. If I had to pick only one though then definitely Beth in exchange to get Andrea back. Andrea never should have died.
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#30
JesusMonroe

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Well, if anybody was disappointed with *insert character*'s death, I got a new machine for you!

It's the patented, FixThisWalkingDeadDeathThatSuckedAndWasOnlyForShockValueAndAddedNothingToTheStoryBesidesACoolSceneOrItJustCould'veBeenDoneMoreEffectively-A-TronTM

Unfortunately, the machine doesn't retcon deaths. If you died in the show, it can't bring you back to life, but can improve your death scene

I've inserted several names in. Let's see what it comes up with!

Jim - Introduce the story that his family was killed in Atlanta. Jim maliciously kills one of the walkers that did it when he comes across him. Jim gets bitten on the arm/leg. The group desperately wants to bring him to the CDC or even amputate his limb, but he refuses. He knows its pointless going on in a world like this and while he knows he's basically committing suicide but accepting his possibly preventable death, he explains that he doesn't want to stick around in a miserable world just to hotwire a car for them once a while. The group gets some newfound insight of how humans are affected by this world and leaves him tied to a tree

Randall - The Walking Dead has this problem with seasonal (or half-seasonal) arcs that kind of don't end with a bang or a whimper. Just a kind of strange farting noise. Randall was no exception. This is what should've happened:
Rick kills Randall. It would massively develop his character and even feed in with his choice to kill Shane later in the season. Shane killing Randall was a copout and was weak resolution to this story that was built on for several episodes. It was all building up to this big decision that Rick never ended up making! He was killed by Deus Ex Shane. What a tease

Shane - Three options for this one.
1. The alternate ending they had for it. Rick and Shane go out in the woods (but since in my version, Randall is dead, then they can be going out hunting or something. I don't know. All the details aren't ironed out) and Shane puts his gun to Rick. We have the same scene that played out in "Better Angels." Rick stabs him and kills him. He retrieves Shane's gun and cries by his corpse for a little. Zombie Shane comes back to life. Rick freaks out and shoots at him. Gun doesn't have ammo. It was a setup. Shane went out, knowing he was going to die since he can't live without Carl or Lori. He cares about them so much, though, he made Rick kill him so he could become the man they need to protect them. Carl shoots zombie Shane

2. Rick and Shane go out in the woods. Shane pulls a gun out on Rick. They have the scene. Carl shows up and shoots Shane in the throat.
Spoiler


3. A combination of 1 and 2. Rick and Shane go out in the woods. Carl kills Shane. Rick takes Shane's gun, but realizes it's not loaded and they run from zombie Shane. They can do what's in the tags later

T-Dog - Give him a death other than the most cliche, bland, and uninspired death in any zombie story ever

Lori - Have her die much later into the story. Get rid of crazy Rick. Also, have her death be a consequence of Rick's actions. I feel like Lori would've died regardless of whether she was with Carol or not. It wouldn't hurt to have the Governor do it either
Spoiler


Axel - He gets shot in the chest. Carol hides behind his corpse from the hail of gunfire. Uh oh! Axel turned! Carol has to hide behind his body and try to fight off and kill him

Merle - Most important one to me. Merle and Daryl arrive at the prison. Soon after, Merle and several guns disappear. Rick thinks, "Crap! Merle's going to tell the Governor the location/layout of the prison and he stole guns for the upcoming fight!"

Rick hops in a car and drives down after him. A few miles down the road, he sees him and runs him over, breaking Merle's back, face, knocking out teeth, smashing his head up, etc. Rick hops out of the car to finish Merle off. Merle explains that he was going to kill the Governor, that's why he stole the guns. Rick sees the evidence around him and sees that it adds up. Merle didn't tell anyone because he knew that if he killed the Governor, he wouldn't be coming back and he knew Daryl wouldn't let him go on the suicide mission and it would be easier if Merle didn't say goodbye.

Rick is completely awestruck. He severely crippled and pretty much killed an innocent man. Rick finishes Merle off and heads back to the prison. Daryl asks where he is. Rick lies and says, "He was a traitor. I had to." Daryl is upset, furious, and has a whole mix of emotions. Eventually, he calms down and realizes it needed to be done. This sets a ticking time bomb in the plot that will go off several episodes or seasons down the road when Daryl inevitably finds out Rick lied and we get a Daryl vs. Rick arc where even the fans have to wonder who to root for

Want anybody else put into the fix-a-tron? Do you think it made certain deaths better or worse?
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Imagine a group of a hundred motorcycles driving down a freeway. Eventually, they hit a junction. One road goes northwest and the other goes northeast. So one guy, we'll call him S, says, "Let's go northwest!" A mile past the intersection, a semi careens into the group and kills ninety of them. Ten are wounded, but they survive and keep going. Eventually, they hit 10,000 miles. S suddenly has his consciousness thrown into his past body right before the junction. Now, he says, "Let's go northeast!" All 100 bikers survive. Happily ever after, right? But what about the ten, no nine, who went northwest and survived? What happens to the reality they were living? Does it just disappear now that S has changed the past? It's not like only bad things happened on that 10,000 mile journey. Maybe one of them fell in love with a gas station attendant and got her pregnant or maybe one adopted a homeless kid that joined the adventure. That 10,000 mile journey would be full of stories. Romances, farewells, friendships...the loss of those ninety lives is horrible and unfortunate, but what would rewriting their history mean? The nine who survived lived full lives and did the best they could with the hand they were dealt. How could it be right to just erase all that? Isn't that worth something? Is there a point to a world where everything is happy? Are people who struggle for a better life just idiots? Being human is about fighting even when it seems hopeless and finding happiness in a world that hates it. Are you saying that's worthless?


#31
Two in the Head

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Bring back Merle, T-dog, Dale and Axel. get rid of Glen, Maggie, Bob, Beth.
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#32
Jgreenwood

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I'd bring back Amy and get rid of Carol.
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#33
bobafett4life

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Merle back would be great, he has the survivor skills needed. i could do without beth if i had to, take judith with her.
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#34
Jayne23

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Kill carol bring back either merle or andrea
either one will be vast improvement.
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#35
Ananse

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Merle back would be great, he has the survivor skills needed. i could do without beth if i had to, take judith with her.


Ita. Merle for beth. He had so many useful skillz.
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#36
xabeard14alonso

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Shane, Shane, Shane, Shane and only Shane.
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 " I guess it's all about the slim chances now. But the slim chance is better than none. "  -  Rick Grimes


#37
mosher

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I'd like to have Dale around longer because dissent is always good for drama, it's realistic to have dissent, and it was always centered around issues that would lead to dissent. T-Dog was being teased to fill that gap, which of course meant he had to die. An interesting T-Dog would never do. Swap with Andrea. Since they decided to waste her story line why bother with her. She was promised to be incredible at season 2's end and they ruined it. It should be noted that if T-Dog became the voice of dissent the show needed like they teased, Dale would no longer be necessary to the balance of the show.

T-Dog should have live a bit longer just to allow the man to act again. Be the new voice of dissent. They threw that character away. Swap with Oscar. I liked Oscar, but if they were going to kill off every prisoner so quickly anyway, why bother. If we keep Oscar (see below) then swap with Beth. Beth is interesting, but all humans are interesting, and some have to die. Her death would make the more central characters of Hershel and Maggie have more to deal with. As well as Rick through Judith (being as how Beth is playing the mother role). Just develop T-Dog.

OR

Keep Oscar. If you give us a bunch of prisoners let us keep one for a while. Axel apparently is interesting in the comics, but I don't know the comic very well. He was just a guy who came along, then died. Oscar would be the one to keep. If we keep Oscar, swap with Beth. (Or swap with T-Dog if he was previously swapped with Beth).

- Coming soon
Glen or Maggie have to die. They are great together, and they are great on the show. But it is an unhappy world and one will die to further that. (Unless they break up.) If one dies, kill Maggie. I love the man Glen has become.

Daryl is a fine character. Remember that as the world continues to deteriorate, it will be increasingly populated with a high percentage of VERY successful survivors. That's not unrealistic, that's actually likely. He will fail again. He is in a very good place now, secure in a family for the first time in his life. Caring about people and trusting people for the first time in his life. I honestly believe that he is doing so well partly to break him again. Which will happen, because Carol will die. Keep Daryl until he loses again, then he can spiral back into the misery he lived for before the apocalypse and die.

Shane and Merle both lived and died excellently. Improvements could be made, but they both had stories that progressed things nicely for the group or even their own personal story. Merle was never going to believably be trustworthy, and having a constantly self-centered pain in the group would be wearisome. He redeemed himself the only way he could. (Although I wish his death scene was written better). There is NO way Glen or Maggie should be capable of having Merle alive among them. That's asking way too much just to keep a great character alive longer.
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#38
Ananse

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I'm rewatching season 1, and Jackie is a pretty cool character. She never had time to develop, but I think had that character been given some time she would've become one tuff cookie.

I'd take Jackie for Maggie.
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#39
Muthawalker

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I'll take Andrea for Beth. Or Shane for Beth, or T-Dog for Beth, Merle for Beth. You get my drift...
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#40
Lioness

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I would bring back Andrea (not Andrea of last season but Andrea of season 2), and Merle and Oscar. I'd drop Beth, maybe Tyreese, and probably Maggie.

T-Dog was not a loss IMO. They never fleshed him out enough for me to care about him.
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Putting out fire with gasoline.

#41
Dr Cank

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I would trade the three Greenes for Dale, Lori and Shane. Then I would have Shane kill Lori (jealous, if I can't have you no one can, rage) and Rick kill Shane.

What are we left with:

No more Shane Praise and Dale. (Yeah for Dale :D ).
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#42
Sweetsister

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I would trade the three Greenes for Dale, Lori and Shane. Then I would have Shane kill Lori (jealous, if I can't have you no one can, rage) and Rick kill Shane.

What are we left with:

No more Shane Praise and Dale. (Yeah for Dale :D ).


I was wondering if anyone would trade Hershel for Dale. Dale was such a loss but I wonder if he would adapt and do better than Hershel (lets forget that Hershel has medical experience). I just mean as an "elder" if you will helping to lead people in this upside downworld. Woud it all be too much for Dale or could he adapt. I think Hershel is doing a great job but IMO he has been a sort of replacement of sorts for Dale. Dale was against loosing his "humanity" but would he adjust to this new world where people like the Guv. exist. Hershel was adamant that his barn walkers were "sick people" but he was able to move past it. It would be interesting to see how Dale would cope especially with the death of Andrea. Plus I miss is crazy expressions.



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#43
Diamat

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No, not Dale please! I hated his constant moralism arguments, haha.

I would trade Sasha (if he lives!) or Beth clearly for Merle. I don't think he gave all he had and he would be that mad (not insane like Ty) guy that I miss in the group.
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#44
NewJeffCT

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I was not a fan of TV show Dale, though I liked him in the comics.

I'd bring back Sophia to give Carl another "child" friend who has gone through the mill like him. I'd get rid of Sasha, I think.

I might bring back Andrea because the group needs a sharpshooter. Get rid of Beth or Maggie.
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#45
Ceepeebee

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Wow....a good thread. A difficult decision.

I'd bring back Andrea (hear me out first), and I'd ditch Glen.

For me, Andrea would now fit in well with the dynamic. Rick too a back seat....Andrea and Daryl would be heading it up. Couple that with the "new" Carol, and we'd either not have ever seen that particular storyline, as it would be Andrea doing those things, or, Carol would have allies who understood her reasoning and perhaps posed more of a threat in terms of Rick's vision of humanity.

As for ditching Glen, poor bugger. I'd like to see Maggie get more air time, and as a revenge addled widow would be nice. Glen's story and transformation is almost complete. He was weak, now strong, but never quite gets to alpha male status such is the competition....he's very much like Dale in that respect.
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#46
Faith

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I'll trade Mazzara AND Gimple for Frank Darabont's eliteness.
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I'm not discussing the Shane/Otis thing...I'd have done the same thing, and that's that. The only thing that can salvage TWD is when Daryl kills Rick.

#47
hannsg

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Milton for the horse

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#48
tigress

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Andrea - for Maggie. Merle for Daryl. Milton for Beth and Oscar for Carl, I still feel something's off with that kid.
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* The woman is wild, a she - cat tamed by the purr of a jaguar. She's deadly man, she could really rip your world apart. *

#49
Lurwalker

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I would want to see Andrea back and no need to see TG anymore. I think that Andrea would've been in her element helping people around the prison as well. She would've been good at a lot of things there and would've been on the council. She would've kicked ass if they could've headed her off towards her comic self.
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