Walkers Evolving?

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#1
Sweetsister

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Kid brought up a good point that I agree with regarding Clara on first sight also thought "talking walker?" The makeup job on her was great and the hair (reminded me of the kid in "The Ring) helped. Obviously she was not a walker.

However the behavior of the walkers at the prison is very different. Before the walkers would be wandering and become "docile" if "food" was not near by. On occasion the group had to make noise to attract them to the fence for various reasons.

From what was shown in the season opener it seems that the are targeting the prison, more and more coming. They don't seem to be roaming aimlessly any more. They have a "drive" to push that fence down and get the "food". I don't think it has to do with the increase population at the prison. Woodbury had a good size group and we never saw that problem there, just the occasional roamer lumbering along without a real seems of purpose until they got close enough to the barrier only to be easily shot. The lack of walkers as well as lack of intensity on their part made it easy for Andrea to jump in and kill one. I don't think anyone at the prison would jump in to the walkers they are facing. Even if the walkers along the fence were less their intensity on getting in is higher.

This all brings me to wonder if over time the walkers are evolving or being affected by the new mystery virus in a way to cause this change. I cant remember if we were told the new "threat" affects everyone including walkers making them more dangerous.

Any thoughts?
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#2
Deadpelican

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Kid brought up a good point that I agree with regarding Clara on first sight also thought "talking walker?" The makeup job on her was great and the hair (reminded me of the kid in "The Ring) helped. Obviously she was not a walker.

However the behavior of the walkers at the prison is very different. Before the walkers would be wandering and become "docile" if "food" was not near by. On occasion the group had to make noise to attract them to the fence for various reasons.

From what was shown in the season opener it seems that the are targeting the prison, more and more coming. They don't seem to be roaming aimlessly any more. They have a "drive" to push that fence down and get the "food". I don't think it has to do with the increase population at the prison. Woodbury had a good size group and we never saw that problem there, just the occasional roamer lumbering along without a real seems of purpose until they got close enough to the barrier only to be easily shot. The lack of walkers as well as lack of intensity on their part made it easy for Andrea to jump in and kill one. I don't think anyone at the prison would jump in to the walkers they are facing. Even if the walkers along the fence were less their intensity on getting in is higher.

This all brings me to wonder if over time the walkers are evolving or being affected by the new mystery virus in a way to cause this change. I cant remember if we were told the new "threat" affects everyone including walkers making them more dangerous.

Any thoughts?


I've been wondering the same thing and I'm not crazy about the idea of "evolving" walkers. It can and has gone to absurd places in other zombie films.

George Romero's movies are a classic example.

In Dawn of the Dead, they were mindless flesh-eating ghouls. In Day of the Dead, a zombie learns to talk, and by the time we get to Land of the Dead, a zombie is carrying a gun and leading his group of "troops" to take revenge on the humans for constantly looting his turf.

Don't wanna go there on The Walking Dead.
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#3
Sweetsister

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I agree with you there the Zombies in Land of the Dead were ridiculous IMO.
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#4
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Kid brought up a good point that I agree with regarding Clara on first sight also thought "talking walker?" The makeup job on her was great and the hair (reminded me of the kid in "The Ring) helped. Obviously she was not a walker.

However the behavior of the walkers at the prison is very different. Before the walkers would be wandering and become "docile" if "food" was not near by. On occasion the group had to make noise to attract them to the fence for various reasons.

From what was shown in the season opener it seems that the are targeting the prison, more and more coming. They don't seem to be roaming aimlessly any more. They have a "drive" to push that fence down and get the "food". I don't think it has to do with the increase population at the prison. Woodbury had a good size group and we never saw that problem there, just the occasional roamer lumbering along without a real seems of purpose until they got close enough to the barrier only to be easily shot. The lack of walkers as well as lack of intensity on their part made it easy for Andrea to jump in and kill one. I don't think anyone at the prison would jump in to the walkers they are facing. Even if the walkers along the fence were less their intensity on getting in is higher.

This all brings me to wonder if over time the walkers are evolving or being affected by the new mystery virus in a way to cause this change. I cant remember if we were told the new "threat" affects everyone including walkers making them more dangerous.

Any thoughts?


I don't think the zombies are evolving. The walkers at the prison can see the humans. This was not so at WB because WB had walls that the walkers couldn't see through. Not only can the walkers see through the fence, but people are at the fence killing them, not across the yard. Also, TG had strict rules at WB about sounds and sights, including a curfew. The walkers have been "drawn" to the fence at the prison by all the activity that wasn't present at WB.
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#5
gracie lou

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I'm not sure they are evolving, but according to Carol, they are acting differently - not spreading out. They seemed to be in groups/clusters. I'm not much for evolving zombies - I'm hoping any changes are fairly minor.
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#6
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I don't think the zombies are evolving. The walkers at the prison can see the humans. This was not so at WB because WB had walls that the walkers couldn't see through. Not only can the walkers see through the fence, but people are at the fence killing them, not across the yard. Also, TG had strict rules at WB about sounds and sights, including a curfew. The walkers have been "drawn" to the fence at the prison by all the activity that wasn't present at WB.



Good points here.

Also, we've seen feeding issues that were brought up with Clara's dead husband.

Are they more pissed off and aggressive because they haven't eaten in a long time? Milton said they become docile if they go long enough without eating. But do they become more aggressive before they become more docile?
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#7
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Good points here.

Also, we've seen feeding issues that were brought up with Clara's dead husband.

Are they more pissed off and aggressive because they haven't eaten in a long time? Milton said they become docile if they go long enough without eating. But do they become more aggressive before they become more docile?


Good questions... I know I become more irritable when I haven't eaten or slept in a while. They have done neither, and since they were once human, I guess it is possible. I also could see becoming more aggressive in an attempt to find food before the body begins to slow down to conserve energy.
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#8
Zprime

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Yea ive never been into the "smart" zombie. When clara? Started talking I thought "plz god no!" Thinking they were going there. I sooooo hope not.

Plus ud think george romero has to know he went down the wrong path with day & land. Given how popular night & dawn is & yet the others are not so. So heres to mindless flesh eaters!!!
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#9
Dr Cank

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The Carol comment about the walkers "bunching up like last week" is the only thing that makes me wonder if there is some "stroy-related" shift in walker behavior. That and Clara indicating Ed (head?) is slowing. For the most part, I feel that the walking dead allows creative liscencing on how the show-runner wants the zombies to act to set the proper appocalypitic mood for each individual season.

Season1: Man Vs. Zombie (super smart zombies. able to hold and use simple tools, climb fences, latters, crawl under busses)

Season2: Man Vs. Zombies (Typical zombie. mangable as individuals, strong as group) (My Ideal TWD Zombie)

Season3: Man Vs. Man (totally week zombies. walk around with little interst. give up on fedding if you are simply behind a door).

Season4: Man V.s ???: but for far the zombies are looking more like season 2
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#10
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Yea ive never been into the "smart" zombie. When clara? Started talking I thought "plz god no!" Thinking they were going there. I sooooo hope not.

Plus ud think george romero has to know he went down the wrong path with day & land. Given how popular night & dawn is & yet the others are not so. So heres to mindless flesh eaters!!!



Romeros ‘problem solving’ zombies started back in the opening of Night of the Living Dead with the late Bill Hinzmans cemetery zombie. He was the first noted zed that seemed somewhat capable of performing very basic and simple problem solving logic. He tries the door handle to get into the car. He tries to smash his hands on the glass. When that doesn’t work what does he do? ? He reaches down and grabs a rock to smash the window. It was a theme that progressed a bit in each film (and yes into eventual ridiculousness although I admit I do love Bub) but regardless was still fascinating and scary none the less - and his zombies to human parallels were brilliant. That being said, I dont think the WD zombies are evolving. A few may have displayed retention of random insinuations of past memories (Door knob, using a rock, trying to climb or even get up from the ground) but I really dont think thats anything more then what we have seen before in the Romero world. Im fine with it as long as its nothing more then that.
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#11
DeadInDetroit

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Personally, i will be extremely pissed off an upset if the walkers do evolve. Im ok with slight changes in behavior like becoming more aggressive an shit like that but i dont want to see them becoming smart an using "tools" an things like that! (i didnt like the walker using the rock to break the store door in S1!)

yes! Land of The Dead was soooo fuckin stupid! As soon as that zombie grabbed the rifle off that guys back it was an instant facepalm! If Walking Dead goes anywhere close to that movie, itll ruin the entire show for me!

As for that ladies husbands head "slowing", i think it was slowing because it was just a head, "food" goes in its mouth an right out its neck....


As far as the bloody eye walkers an Patrick,im hoping its just some disease that isnt related to the zombie virus!!!
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#12
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Didn't a zombie in the first season of TWD smash a glass door with a rock? And didn't Morgan's zombie wife try using the door handle?
They seemed smarter in season 1, if you ask me.
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#13
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Judging by the sneak peeks for next weeks episode, which we obviously can't talk about here, there is at least one good reason why they are grouping up. Just wanted to point out that we don't have the full story yet on their changed behavior..I don't think they are evolving at all.

I also think they are attracting walkers to the prison with the constant presence of the livestock in the yard. The walkers can see them and smell them. They work out in the yard on the garden, and the kids are apparently allowed to wander the yard. That seems like a lot of activity to me, activity that attracts the walkers. Then more walkers are probably attracted to a group of milling walkers, and a build-up happens.
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#14
Macilly

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I don't think they are evolving. I think there is a storyline reason for why they are herding to the fences. Perhaps, the dumb kids who say they are 'just different' are doing something but I don't think they are getting smarter. At least, they aren't climbing the fences yet! LOL
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#15
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Perhaps zombies can exhibit slight variations in their intellect based on the makeup of their individual brains. Would an Einstein respond to stimuli the same as an Axel?

I think walkers are actually deteriorating over time just as a corpse would rot only more slowly. I really doubt the show is going to start introducing zombie characters with anything more than a primitive level of cognizance. It would completely change the show. And not for the better.
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#16
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I liked in the first season how they retained some of their motor skills. It was only a select few, you didnt see every zombie trying to climb the fence after Rick and Glenn. Some are just more hungry as others, and I do believe that there is a tiny spark of what once was. I don't mind the zombies getting "smarter" or even more feral, it makes sense when you think about it. It would be their next step of "evolution", just look back at cavemen times, thats how I look at the zombies. Caniballistic Cavemen.
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#17
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Good questions... I know I become more irritable when I haven't eaten or slept in a while. They have done neither, and since they were once human, I guess it is possible. I also could see becoming more aggressive in an attempt to find food before the body begins to slow down to conserve energy.


True, but I had thought that if the Zombies were "starving" they'd become weaker and continue to decompose making them even weaker not "aggressive". I also get what you mean about the walkers being attracted to the people by the fence. It hasn't been shown but I thought the people were there killing them because they had to, the constant build up of walkers and pressure on the fence meant a constant group of people at the fence killing them hopefully before they become overwhelmed.

In last season when they killed them at the fence sometimes they had to draw them in (when Carol wanted a cadaver and Glen wanted a ring) even then they diddnt show as much aggression or strength.

The other thing that has me wondering is why such large groups are zeroing in on the prison? I understand about the livestock but I think they keep them far from the perimeter. Hershel had plenty of livestock on the farm yet what brought on the Zombie horde seems to have been sound (helicopter/gunshots).

If there is a virus spreading isn't there a chance it would affect the walkers as well affecting them, changing their behavior. I know I used the word "evolved" that was to cover Clara in all this because I did think for a moment "talking Zombies"??? That woulda been the shark jump for me.
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#18
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Judging by the sneak peeks for next weeks episode, which we obviously can't talk about here, there is at least one good reason why they are grouping up. Just wanted to point out that we don't have the full story yet on their changed behavior..I don't think they are evolving at all.

I also think they are attracting walkers to the prison with the constant presence of the livestock in the yard. The walkers can see them and smell them. They work out in the yard on the garden, and the kids are apparently allowed to wander the yard. That seems like a lot of activity to me, activity that attracts the walkers. Then more walkers are probably attracted to a group of milling walkers, and a build-up happens.


The smell of the livestock is a really good point. Animals like pigs stink to high heaven. That stench could draw in several walkers and the other activity keep them around.
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#19
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True, but I had thought that if the Zombies were "starving" they'd become weaker and continue to decompose making them even weaker not "aggressive". I also get what you mean about the walkers being attracted to the people by the fence. It hasn't been shown but I thought the people were there killing them because they had to, the constant build up of walkers and pressure on the fence meant a constant group of people at the fence killing them hopefully before they become overwhelmed.

In last season when they killed them at the fence sometimes they had to draw them in (when Carol wanted a cadaver and Glen wanted a ring) even then they diddnt show as much aggression or strength.

The other thing that has me wondering is why such large groups are zeroing in on the prison? I understand about the livestock but I think they keep them far from the perimeter. Hershel had plenty of livestock on the farm yet what brought on the Zombie horde seems to have been sound (helicopter/gunshots).

If there is a virus spreading isn't there a chance it would affect the walkers as well affecting them, changing their behavior. I know I used the word "evolved" that was to cover Clara in all this because I did think for a moment "talking Zombies"??? That woulda been the shark jump for me.


Last season, the group spoke of herd in the vicinity, but we never really saw one. Maybe there are more around because a small herd past by drawn by the smell of the livestock, which I am not so sure is kept that far from the fence. Rick was stirring them up with his gardening. I don't think the animal pen is that far from the garden and animals such as pigs stink to high heaven, so I think they could be smelt from anywhere in the immediate vicinity of the prison.
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#20
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Romeros ‘problem solving’ zombies started back in the opening of Night of the Living Dead with the late Bill Hinzmans cemetery zombie. He was the first noted zed that seemed somewhat capable of performing very basic and simple problem solving logic. He tries the door handle to get into the car. He tries to smash his hands on the glass. When that doesn’t work what does he do? ? He reaches down and grabs a rock to smash the window. It was a theme that progressed a bit in each film (and yes into eventual ridiculousness although I admit I do love Bub) but regardless was still fascinating and scary none the less - and his zombies to human parallels were brilliant. That being said, I dont think the WD zombies are evolving. A few may have displayed retention of random insinuations of past memories (Door knob, using a rock, trying to climb or even get up from the ground) but I really dont think thats anything more then what we have seen before in the Romero world. Im fine with it as long as its nothing more then that.


That's fantastic, it reads like the intro to a historical overview of zombies in film.

Didn't a zombie in the first season of TWD smash a glass door with a rock? And didn't Morgan's zombie wife try using the door handle?
They seemed smarter in season 1, if you ask me.

And, fence climbing, too, although someone mentioned that. Heck, I don't think they should be able to negotiate stairs all that well, if you think about it. Maybe on all fours.
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#21
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I also think that because now they have shifts of people taking out the walkers at the fence, it's a catch-22. Their presence at the fence is drawing more walkers there.
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#22
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I understand about the livestock, I live in the city but I've been on farms, pigs to smell but not like food to me anyway lol. Weve seen lots of ways that Walkers are attracted to "food" movement, noise and smell. Weve also seen that in some cases if a person doesnt move they may not be detected, if a person covers themselves with the dead they may not be detected. I think that there must be more to it than just the livestock. I do have to watch the episode again to see if the walkers reacted to the horse, I know it was galloping at a fast pace but couldn't a group of walkers smell the horse coming and try to swarm it? That may be stretching the point but I think its more than the livestock, but that's just me ;)
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#23
Mr. NomNom

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No. They should not evolve. I also don't they will. If they do I'm done.
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#24
Zprime

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Which to me is kinda facepalmn. Might as well run around flapping ur arms and shooting off fireworks


Judging by the sneak peeks for next weeks episode, which we obviously can't talk about here, there is at least one good reason why they are grouping up. Just wanted to point out that we don't have the full story yet on their changed behavior..I don't think they are evolving at all.

I also think they are attracting walkers to the prison with the constant presence of the livestock in the yard. The walkers can see them and smell them. They work out in the yard on the garden, and the kids are apparently allowed to wander the yard. That seems like a lot of activity to me, activity that attracts the walkers. Then more walkers are probably attracted to a group of milling walkers, and a build-up happens.


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#25
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<the last post has been removed>

Please save promo discussion for the Spoiler Forum, thanks.
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