[Apocalypse]

So Hershel survives getting his leg amputated but Lori can't survive a c-section?
I'm no medical expert but I didn't think cutting someone's uterus open instantly kills them.
Lori probably wasn't even dead when Carl shot her...

Couldn't she have survived long enough for Hershel to come back and stitch her up after the fire-fight was over? Don't get me wrong, Lori was annoying and I was waiting for her to die, but not like this!

In the comics...

Spoiler

Lori and the baby die together.

It's going to be interesting to see how they manage a motherless baby in the ZA. Hopefully Daryll makes a sucessful WalMart run for diapers, formula and onesies. So help me God, if they show this baby getting killed in a gruesome way I'm not watching the show any more and I give up faith in humanity!

[Kat]

No medical expert here, but I think she was already bleeding out BEFORE the c-sect. So, take a stressed out, bleeding body, no coagulants and nice supportive therapy of modern medicine, shock, pain, questionable pre-natal care. . .

Pretty much it was a death sentence.

[DeadCave]

Well if anyone makes a diaper run it'll be Glen and Maggie since they're the token gofers of the group.
That Hershel didn't die of shock when his leg was getting chopped off (amputation implies a controlled situation) is a miracle. An impromptu c-section out in the field is extraordinarily dangerous. It's why Carol wanted to practice before hand if Hershel wasn't available. Normally you'd only need a small incision to do a c-section, just large enough to allow a baby's shoulders to fit through the opening created.
Lori likely died of blood loss as a lot of women centuries ago did due to vaginal tearing as the baby's head crowned. The pelvis bone of a woman is designed to expand to allow passage of the infant, but the vagina is not, thus the pain is from the tearing of the tissue which of course results in large blood loss unless it's stopped. It's why doctors stitch back up and do all the other stuff during delivery. I've only witnessed one live birthing (was in an elevator with a woman who was enroute to the hospital from her office-job and the birth was rushed - as they sometimes are), it's bloody, messy and yeah I understood then why a lot of husbands pass out when witnessing their wife giving birth.
Anyway, without proper medical facilities and training/experience a woman's chances of survival during child-birth drops dramatically. It's possible but by a slim margin.

No medical expert here, but I think she was already bleeding out BEFORE the c-sect. So, take a stressed out, bleeding body, no coagulants and nice supportive therapy of modern medicine, shock, pain, questionable pre-natal care. . .

Pretty much it was a death sentence.

What she said.

[p-dizzle]

Herschel's leg amputation what somewhat done right. Belt was put on the slow the bleeding and amputated within seconds.
Within minutes he was back to the cells where his leg was raised to slow the blood loos even more and it was covered and padded. Even then his heartbeat slowed dramatically and even stopped completely hence the CPR done by Lori.

Lori was straight out bleeding non stop specially with all the pressure from within the belly. Then Maggie tossed her innerds around like salad to get to the baby. No anesthetic, shock of pain and blood loos would have put her heart into shock and she would have been dead in minutes. By the time that umbilical cord was cut and no one was there to clean, stop the bleeding and patch her up she was done. Carl knew it. Maggie knew it.

The one thing I didnt catch even after watching it twice was... what she said before Maggie sliced her open?

Anyone?

[Kat]

"Goodnight, love." -- nice story about how that line evolved in the TV Line interview in another thread.

I am no Lori fan, but Sarah Wayne Callies did a nice job this season.

[Kikora]

C-Sections before modern medicine was only performed on dead bodies, because there are too many blood vessels in the way, without some way to suction the blood out, without an exact cut, without understanding exactly where the uterus is... There's no way. Maggie was pushing at Lori's organs, her intestines, searching for the baby, and she had already lost a lot of blood. Any number of factors including shock could have killed her. She was either dead or dying when Carl caught her.

Maggie could have been instructed more, in my opinion. Had it been Hershel, or maybe Carol, then she might have stood a better chance, but Maggie shouldn't have let her push without checking the cervix. Labor can last for hours, contractions are meant to ready the body for labor. I'm no doctor or nurse, but couldn't have been more than twenty minutes into labor, there was no way she was ready.

[Judari]

I agree with everyone else. C-sections aren't a simple surgery, even if Lori survived her infection rate would have been super high and she likely would have died.

The one thing I didnt catch even after watching it twice was... what she said before Maggie sliced her open?

Anyone?

She said "Goodnight, love." If you read the EW interview with Sarah Wayne Callies she explains it and its actually pretty heart felt and sad. But basically it was her goodbye to Rick.

[Serenity@sea]

Herschel's leg amputation what somewhat done right. Belt was put on the slow the bleeding and amputated within seconds.
Within minutes he was back to the cells where his leg was raised to slow the blood loos even more and it was covered and padded. Even then his heartbeat slowed dramatically and even stopped completely hence the CPR done by Lori.

Lori was straight out bleeding non stop specially with all the pressure from within the belly. Then Maggie tossed her innerds around like salad to get to the baby. No anesthetic, shock of pain and blood loos would have put her heart into shock and she would have been dead in minutes. By the time that umbilical cord was cut and no one was there to clean, stop the bleeding and patch her up she was done. Carl knew it. Maggie knew it.

The one thing I didnt catch even after watching it twice was... what she said before Maggie sliced her open?

Anyone?

Was it Goodnight, Love?

[Apocalypse]

Then Maggie tossed her innerds around like salad to get to the baby.

Technically, no. The innards are not in front of the baby but rather behind or on top. There are no innards to push around to get to a baby during a c-sec, but yea I get your point. I guess she couldn't have survived that...

[CaptainJax]

I'd say with a doctor and maybe a few good nurses you could have a 50/50 chance of survival, but Maggie had never done a c-section before or deliver a baby in the standard way according to what we know, let alone in a dirty prison room with a dirty screwdriver? I'd say I'd be surprised if she actually lived.

[Grénádé]

Ginnsuing someones leg off below the knee is a little bit less complicated than what Maggie was being asked to do.

When a non-professional starts cutting someones stomach open with a dirty pocket knife then rummaging through their insides with grubby hands while uttering "I can't tell if this is a leg or and arm" is not something some stitches and R&R can fix.

[p-dizzle]

The thing now tho is... Did Lori die under the same gun that also killed her baby father?

[Grénádé]

The thing now tho is... Did Lori die under the same gun that also killed her baby father?

I'd wager it is.

They had the little flash back where Rick handed Carl the gun, then immediately shot back to present with gun in frame.

[ll wrath ll]

The thing now tho is... Did Lori die under the same gun that also killed her baby father?

The one good thing coming out of Lori's death. We have a Shane in the world again.

[Tobedesu]

I think that if she had had survived all that, then doctors would be out of a job.

That was some heavy stuff that she went through.

[UniformSierra]

Not a snowball's chance in hell she was going to survive that c-section. However, she seemed to have started pushing about 2 minutes after going into labor which is absolutely bullshit. No woman starts pushing until what, a couple hours in? Rick must feel so terrible now. The wounds were slowly mending in their relationship and now she's gone. At least she went out with some dignitiy.

I learned something today. I have no idea the vagina always tears during child birth and that's why babies have blood on them, or so somebody said upthread.

Very sad and epic episode. The loss of T-dog, who was proptly replaced by the other black guy *cough*, and Lori's death were so tragic. I wish that piece of shit that Rick left for dead was thrown to the walkers. So many emotions felt during this episode I can't express them eloquently.

[Undeadhead]

With a second child births usually tend to go faster. My sister went into labor and had my nephew 5 minutes after getting to the hospital.

Even in a clean environment c-sections are a high risk surgery. My wife had an emergency c-section done with our first child, the second was scheduled and the third one happens tomorrow. She was totally blown away by the scenes they actually showed on tv and now she's kinda freaked out about the whole thing.

[Apocalypse]

I learned something today. I have no idea the vagina always tears during child birth and that's why babies have blood on them, or so somebody said upthread.

Vaginas don't ALWAYS tear during childbirth and that's definitely not the main cause of blood loss in labouring women. I, for one, didn't tear (WHICH I AM SO FREAKIN' GRATEFUL FOR). Post partum bleeding has nothing to do with tearing. I bled for like 2 weeks straight with blood clots and everything after having my baby which is totally normal.

[Crushedknee]

Unless they find some formula somebody need to start lactating. Can be done but it time to keep the baby alive? I dunno.

[BethTexas]

So Hershel survives getting his leg amputated but Lori can't survive a c-section?
I'm no medical expert but I didn't think cutting someone's uterus open instantly kills them.
Lori probably wasn't even dead when Carl shot her...

Couldn't she have survived long enough for Hershel to come back and stitch her up after the fire-fight was over? Don't get me wrong, Lori was annoying and I was waiting for her to die, but not like this!

In the comics...

Spoiler

Lori and the baby die together.

It's going to be interesting to see how they manage a motherless baby in the ZA. Hopefully Daryll makes a sucessful WalMart run for diapers, formula and onesies. So help me God, if they show this baby getting killed in a gruesome way I'm not watching the show any more and I give up faith in humanity!

My guess is that her uterus ruptured. She had Carl by C-section and the scar tissue there simply gave way and she bled out. A lot of doctors won't even consider a vaginal delivery after C-section because of the possibility of uterine rupture. It's a hot topic, some claiming that it's perfectly possible to deliver naturally and the doctor is just afraid of a lawsuit. I don't know, but I do think that if the hemmorhaging didn';t kill her the shock of surgery with no anethetic would have.

[Grénádé]

somebody need to start lactating.

[BethTexas]

No medical expert here, but I think she was already bleeding out BEFORE the c-sect. So, take a stressed out, bleeding body, no coagulants and nice supportive therapy of modern medicine, shock, pain, questionable pre-natal care. . .

Pretty much it was a death sentence.

Yes, and she was also malnourished and had no prenatal care. This was probably not going to end well no matter what.

[Creeper]

My guess is that her uterus ruptured. She had Carl by C-section and the scar tissue there simply gave way and she bled out.

This is my guess also.

Besides, even if she hadn't been bleeding out before Maggie cut her open, a c-section wound can't really be compared to a amputated limb. You can bleed out from both, but the stump is something that all you can do is apply pressure, elevate, etc. I don't see how you can simply "apply pressure" on a c-section type wound. Until it gets stiched up, she is going to be bleeding. She would have been dead long before Hershel ever got to her.

But yeah, as far as how her labour progressed from getting her first contraction to pushing..um...probably not. You don't push until you are dilated enough to get anywhere. "I have to push." No you don't honey. That part was dumb. Though, it is possible that Lori never actually experienced labour..sometimes c-sections are scheduled as surgery(with no labour), so maybe she just didn't know better?

[Steph]

I think she only started pushing so soon because she was starting to panic. I've had two babies and I didn't start pushing THAT soon, even if both of my labors and deliveries were short (6 for the first, 4 hours for the second, about three pushes for both babies). So short labor and deliveries do happen, I think she was just in full freak out mode.

[The Custodian]

As far as how long labor lasts, it's all differenet for different ladies and will be different for one lady for multiple pregnancies. You can have braxton Hicks contractions for weeks and can be fully dialated and ready to push before any severe contrations set in, but it is rare and usually a labor like that would be a sign of a easy delivery.

Also, not a doctor, but I am the father of 5 children and my wife made me read every book written on the sugject. :-)