[Merle Dixon]

what i meant by no offence is that i dont want to start anything and im just giving my opinion. i obviously know how i would react to the situation. and my opinion is that throwing people out of your farm when they cause only a little truble because they have a few injured people & a missing person. once everyone is healed and found then whats the danger in keeping them? and to throw them out into the hellhole outside the farm is selfish and thats my opinion and its not gona change

[NarwhalZombie]

It is offensive when you call people on this forum "selfish" for defending Herschel. No one cares if you state your opinion on these matters and is not offended that you dislike him. Its how you express your dislike for the situation that ruffles feathers here.

[Barry Cade]

My tuppenorth? Well, I think he's a good character; a great antagonist; I think he's difficult to empathise with or indeed, like; however, in the grand scheme of things, which has been done to death on forums here and all over the globe; he is a key component of this slow-burning thread.


It's thanks to Herschel we're learning that becoming complacent or comfortable in one place in a ZA is a dangerous state of affairs; yes, we've been stuck in one place for a good few episodes; yes, we're not seeing zombie attack after zombie attack after zombie attack; yes, we don't really find Herschel particularly good company.


However, he's complex and difficult; he's an alpha-male in a situation where there's already alpha-males struggling for dominance; he's also got a peculiar world-view that could put everyone at risk. That makes him a good character; one who I wouldn't mind seeing come back later on once we've seen our TV show move on, to Fort Benning; The Prison; another state or just down the road into more peril. Yay Herschel!

[Merle Dixon]

well my opinion is that kicking the survivors out is selfish. im not insulting anybody

[Harrison Blackwood]

Merle Dixon, on 28 November 2011 - 01:37 AM, said:

well my opinion is that kicking the survivors out is selfish. im not insulting anybody

Well having seen episode 7 now - Herschel did reconsider and decided to give Rick and the group another chance.  So he showed a conscience and a christian and charitable attitude. His only stipulation was they follow his rules.

In the meantime Daryl went to steal (or whatever you call borrowing someone elses property without their permission)
another horse again if not interrupted by Carol. Shane distributed all the guns against Ricks, Dales, and Herschels wishes, let the walkers out of the barn and then the whole group had a Turkey shoot which included blowing away Herschels wife and stepson as well as Sophia.

Which by the look of it sent Herschel into shock or traumatized him.

Perhaps Rick should ask Herschel for another chance?  While their reloading?

[Merle Dixon]

Harrison Blackwood, on 28 November 2011 - 03:40 PM, said:

Well having seen episode 7 now - Herschel did reconsider and decided to give Rick and the group another chance.  So he showed a conscience and a christian and charitable attitude. His only stipulation was they follow his rules.

In the meantime Daryl went to steal (or whatever you call borrowing someone elses property without their permission)
another horse again if not interrupted by Carol. Shane distributed all the guns against Ricks, Dales, and Herschels wishes, let the walkers out of the barn and then the whole group had a Turkey shoot which included blowing away Herschels wife and stepson as well as Sophia.

Which by the look of it sent Herschel into shock or traumatized him.

Perhaps Rick should ask Herschel for another chance?  While their reloading?

this is realy a cliff hangar i wonder whats gona happen next half season. i dont realy blame herschel i he wants to kick them out now cause before he didnt have a reason, now he does. i dont expect him to let the survivors stay

[Phr0z3n]

Reposted from my thread on the front page...didn't see this thread.


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Ok, so...I'm not a cold blooded killer, a homicidal maniac, or a  frustrated sexually confused teenager.  That being said, if I were Rick,  Herschel would have never made it out of the kitchen.  

It may seem extreme, but the rules of this world have changed. Titles,  ownership, technicalities etc...no longer hold any sway in a  post-apocalypse world.  Therefore, if I'm Rick, the moment Herschel  tells me I'm out in a week, and all my friends too, he's dead.  I go  outside, grab Shane and Daryl, arm up, and kill Herschel, kill his  remaining family, and occupy the farm from there on out.  Massacre the  barn occupants, tend the fields.  Problem solved.

Was anyone else rooting for this to happen?  Hersch and his denial have  absolutely no place in a survival oriented world.  His religious faith  doesn't bother me, as anything that provides comfort is of value in a  situation like that. But trying to stonewall a group of armed  survivalists into leaving your safe haven is not realistic and puts you  and your family in danger.

If he played it right, he could have had a personal security/free labor  force at his disposal. Instead, his values and stubbornness have doomed  him and his.

I don't know, maybe you leave the women alive for procreative purposes,  but if it were me, I wouldn't leave anyone around to avenge dear old  dad.

Thoughts?

[Merle Dixon]

Phr0z3n, on 28 November 2011 - 04:03 PM, said:

Reposted from my thread on the front page...didn't see this thread.


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


Ok, so...I'm not a cold blooded killer, a homicidal maniac, or a  frustrated sexually confused teenager.  That being said, if I were Rick,  Herschel would have never made it out of the kitchen.  

It may seem extreme, but the rules of this world have changed. Titles,  ownership, technicalities etc...no longer hold any sway in a  post-apocalypse world.  Therefore, if I'm Rick, the moment Herschel  tells me I'm out in a week, and all my friends too, he's dead.  I go  outside, grab Shane and Daryl, arm up, and kill Herschel, kill his  remaining family, and occupy the farm from there on out.  Massacre the  barn occupants, tend the fields.  Problem solved.

Was anyone else rooting for this to happen?  Hersch and his denial have  absolutely no place in a survival oriented world.  His religious faith  doesn't bother me, as anything that provides comfort is of value in a  situation like that. But trying to stonewall a group of armed  survivalists into leaving your safe haven is not realistic and puts you  and your family in danger.

If he played it right, he could have had a personal security/free labor  force at his disposal. Instead, his values and stubbornness have doomed  him and his.

I don't know, maybe you leave the women alive for procreative purposes,  but if it were me, I wouldn't leave anyone around to avenge dear old  dad.

Thoughts?

i agree herschel doesnt have the survival instinct that shane/rick/daryl and other survivors have

[Zprime]

I love comments like this cause their so unfounded & would never happen. So what your saying is you hear the word no & come out with gens & murder in ur eyes? That's shanes route & as its been stated is going to get you nowhere.

Phr0z3n, on 28 November 2011 - 04:03 PM, said:

Reposted from my thread on the front page...didn't see this thread.


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


Ok, so...I'm not a cold blooded killer, a homicidal maniac, or a  frustrated sexually confused teenager.  That being said, if I were Rick,  Herschel would have never made it out of the kitchen.  

It may seem extreme, but the rules of this world have changed. Titles,  ownership, technicalities etc...no longer hold any sway in a  post-apocalypse world.  Therefore, if I'm Rick, the moment Herschel  tells me I'm out in a week, and all my friends too, he's dead.  I go  outside, grab Shane and Daryl, arm up, and kill Herschel, kill his  remaining family, and occupy the farm from there on out.  Massacre the  barn occupants, tend the fields.  Problem solved.

Was anyone else rooting for this to happen?  Hersch and his denial have  absolutely no place in a survival oriented world.  His religious faith  doesn't bother me, as anything that provides comfort is of value in a  situation like that. But trying to stonewall a group of armed  survivalists into leaving your safe haven is not realistic and puts you  and your family in danger.

If he played it right, he could have had a personal security/free labor  force at his disposal. Instead, his values and stubbornness have doomed  him and his.

I don't know, maybe you leave the women alive for procreative purposes,  but if it were me, I wouldn't leave anyone around to avenge dear old  dad.

Thoughts?

[Mr.Misery]

I really hope he's not the new Sophia the rest of the season

[LurkingWalker14]

He is a very intimidating character... He's tough yet hopeful that the walkers could be redeemed and because of that it often clouds his judgement.

[Merle Dixon]

hershel got owned by shane.....any thoughts on how shane just took over the situation????

[Merle Dixon]

after episode 7 i changed my vote to just i dont like him 25/75. i used to have he needs to die soon. he showed realy good stepsin episode 7 maggie realy convinced him the old "what would jesus do" situation and i think that changed hershels mind. also when he didnt realy flip out physicaly when shane and the others were shooting the zombies also gained him some points with me. so now hes just a character i dont realy like. i say i like him 35% and dislike 65%

[unseen]

Phr0z3n, on 28 November 2011 - 04:03 PM, said:

Reposted from my thread on the front page...didn't see this thread.


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


Ok, so...I'm not a cold blooded killer, a homicidal maniac, or a  frustrated sexually confused teenager.  That being said, if I were Rick,  Herschel would have never made it out of the kitchen.  

It may seem extreme, but the rules of this world have changed. Titles,  ownership, technicalities etc...no longer hold any sway in a  post-apocalypse world.  Therefore, if I'm Rick, the moment Herschel  tells me I'm out in a week, and all my friends too, he's dead.  I go  outside, grab Shane and Daryl, arm up, and kill Herschel, kill his  remaining family, and occupy the farm from there on out.  Massacre the  barn occupants, tend the fields.  Problem solved.

Was anyone else rooting for this to happen?  Hersch and his denial have  absolutely no place in a survival oriented world.  His religious faith  doesn't bother me, as anything that provides comfort is of value in a  situation like that. But trying to stonewall a group of armed  survivalists into leaving your safe haven is not realistic and puts you  and your family in danger.

If he played it right, he could have had a personal security/free labor  force at his disposal. Instead, his values and stubbornness have doomed  him and his.

I don't know, maybe you leave the women alive for procreative purposes,  but if it were me, I wouldn't leave anyone around to avenge dear old  dad.

Thoughts?

I'm with you on te part that he has no place in this world. But i'm sure it's caused by his religous part, so it does bother me.
Religious people would get raped in a zombie apocalypse, they rely on their god far to much to see that their world has gone to shit.
That's why i'm so glad Shane stood up and did what had to be done. In the end he was actually right, Sophia is dead meat, so all the trouble they went to, and all the dangers they had around them where for nothing.
Hershell is just blinded and totally unusefull, quite the controary. But killing him won't do any good, it probably sets off a gun fight between "the gang" and Hershell's family.

[Lizeroo]

Mr.Misery, on 28 November 2011 - 07:10 PM, said:

I really hope he's not the new Sophia the rest of the season

I don't think he's likeable enough for it to turn out like Sophia. If he went missing, more than a few people would be happy about it (Hooray, we get to stay on the farm and have lots of babies and eat all their food! Yaay!).

[VulpesInculta]

I do like and can understand Hershel as a man who's trying to protect his family, but I think he's approached many issues in a bad manner.

[Merle Dixon]

VulpesInculta, on 29 November 2011 - 01:53 AM, said:

I do like and can understand Hershel as a man who's trying to protect his family, but I think he's approached many issues in a bad manner.

i can accept that. but that doesnt mean i like him as a character. i see him 35% good and 65% bad

[ashtonfrancis]

One thing I have trouble understanding is this notion of *property* that people keep bringing up.  

The idea that the farm/land "belongs" to Hershel and therefore he gets to decide who is allowed to stay and how they are to behave strikes me as foolish.  This is the zombie apocalypse.  It's anything but business as usual, and the old rules don't apply.

That Rick "the leader" continually defers to Hershel and doing things his way (*especially* bringing in more walkers to the camp) shows that he's losing sight of the bigger picture.  These people are a band of very few who are attempting to survive the zombie apocalypse, and any safe haven ought to be used.  That an old man who doesn't understand the severity of the situation says "This belongs to me" and tells em to move on, and that most (if not all) of the people are willing to abide by those rules, is wack.  Private property more important than the survival of the human race?  Pfft.  Not to say that the group hasn't made mistakes or messed up, but Hershels line of thinking ultimately ought not be respected given the circumstances.

[Merle Dixon]

ashtonfrancis, on 29 November 2011 - 02:33 AM, said:

One thing I have trouble understanding is this notion of *property* that people keep bringing up.  

The idea that the farm/land "belongs" to Hershel and therefore he gets to decide who is allowed to stay and how they are to behave strikes me as foolish.  This is the zombie apocalypse.  It's anything but business as usual, and the old rules don't apply.

That Rick "the leader" continually defers to Hershel and doing things his way (*especially* bringing in more walkers to the camp) shows that he's losing sight of the bigger picture.  These people are a band of very few who are attempting to survive the zombie apocalypse, and any safe haven ought to be used.  That an old man who doesn't understand the severity of the situation says "This belongs to me" and tells em to move on, and that most (if not all) of the people are willing to abide by those rules, is wack.  Private property more important than the survival of the human race?  Pfft.  Not to say that the group hasn't made mistakes or messed up, but Hershels line of thinking ultimately ought not be respected given the circumstances.

you have a good point there. rick should fight for his place on the farm not stand by as herschel kicks him out

[zedhatch]

ashtonfrancis, on 29 November 2011 - 02:33 AM, said:

One thing I have trouble understanding is this notion of *property* that people keep bringing up.  

The idea that the farm/land "belongs" to Hershel and therefore he gets to decide who is allowed to stay and how they are to behave strikes me as foolish.  This is the zombie apocalypse.  It's anything but business as usual, and the old rules don't apply.

That Rick "the leader" continually defers to Hershel and doing things his way (*especially* bringing in more walkers to the camp) shows that he's losing sight of the bigger picture.  These people are a band of very few who are attempting to survive the zombie apocalypse, and any safe haven ought to be used.  That an old man who doesn't understand the severity of the situation says "This belongs to me" and tells em to move on, and that most (if not all) of the people are willing to abide by those rules, is wack.  Private property more important than the survival of the human race?  Pfft.  Not to say that the group hasn't made mistakes or messed up, but Hershels line of thinking ultimately ought not be respected given the circumstances.

Thing is that when you begin to get into "Take what you want" you get into a very slippery slope and I think Rick understands that (He seemed to much better in the comic and event talked about it breifly).

There comes a point where the restoration of civilization is an issue, and it's really hard to justify laws and such if they are built on blood (again another moral issue later examined in the comic in relation to murder).  

Rick's also much more about keeping his humanity above all else.  He won't lose it like that (and even goes searching for other options, which gets the group off the farm at last so it suits the story too).

[Mike010]

Phr0z3n, on 28 November 2011 - 04:03 PM, said:

Reposted from my thread on the front page...didn't see this thread.


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


Ok, so...I'm not a cold blooded killer, a homicidal maniac, or a  frustrated sexually confused teenager.  That being said, if I were Rick,  Herschel would have never made it out of the kitchen.  

It may seem extreme, but the rules of this world have changed. Titles,  ownership, technicalities etc...no longer hold any sway in a  post-apocalypse world.  Therefore, if I'm Rick, the moment Herschel  tells me I'm out in a week, and all my friends too, he's dead.  I go  outside, grab Shane and Daryl, arm up, and kill Herschel, kill his  remaining family, and occupy the farm from there on out.  Massacre the  barn occupants, tend the fields.  Problem solved.

Was anyone else rooting for this to happen?  Hersch and his denial have  absolutely no place in a survival oriented world.  His religious faith  doesn't bother me, as anything that provides comfort is of value in a  situation like that. But trying to stonewall a group of armed  survivalists into leaving your safe haven is not realistic and puts you  and your family in danger.

If he played it right, he could have had a personal security/free labor  force at his disposal. Instead, his values and stubbornness have doomed  him and his.

I don't know, maybe you leave the women alive for procreative purposes,  but if it were me, I wouldn't leave anyone around to avenge dear old  dad.

Thoughts?

+1 - I love this forum for the quality of the comments posted around.


Until episode 7, I didn't really like Hershel, I thought he was stupid.

But the Sofia scene makes me understand something.

If one of our beloved (wife, son, daugther, mother etc..) would turn into Zed, it would be hard to kill him/her. For most of us, a crazy hope of recovery/cure, will lead us to keep them somewhere.

But doing that, it would be irrational and dangereous. You expose yourself to danger. I'm sure many people turned into Zed because of this kind of thinking.

The only difference between Hershel and the majority of us, is that he's just not try to protect the Zed coming from his family.

[Eric Cartman]

I dont like hershal much.

[zombieluver]

A crazy old man who still sees the zombies as his family.

[Deadpelican]

Phr0z3n, on 28 November 2011 - 04:03 PM, said:

Reposted from my thread on the front page...didn't see this thread.


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


Ok, so...I'm not a cold blooded killer, a homicidal maniac, or a  frustrated sexually confused teenager.  That being said, if I were Rick,  Herschel would have never made it out of the kitchen.  

It may seem extreme, but the rules of this world have changed. Titles,  ownership, technicalities etc...no longer hold any sway in a  post-apocalypse world.  Therefore, if I'm Rick, the moment Herschel  tells me I'm out in a week, and all my friends too, he's dead.  I go  outside, grab Shane and Daryl, arm up, and kill Herschel, kill his  remaining family, and occupy the farm from there on out.  Massacre the  barn occupants, tend the fields.  Problem solved.

Was anyone else rooting for this to happen?  Hersch and his denial have  absolutely no place in a survival oriented world.  His religious faith  doesn't bother me, as anything that provides comfort is of value in a  situation like that. But trying to stonewall a group of armed  survivalists into leaving your safe haven is not realistic and puts you  and your family in danger.

If he played it right, he could have had a personal security/free labor  force at his disposal. Instead, his values and stubbornness have doomed  him and his.

I don't know, maybe you leave the women alive for procreative purposes,  but if it were me, I wouldn't leave anyone around to avenge dear old  dad.

Thoughts?

This is what I'd call "Shane logic." Impulsive. reckless and with zero thought to long- term consequences.  Yeah, they  could murder Herschell and his family and then, a week or so  later a dozen or so  people (with guns) show up at the farm claiming to be Herchell's extended family and want to know what the hell is going on because they haven't heard from Herschell and co. in over a week. Turns out, in fact that everyone living within a 30 mile radius is part of Herschell's extended family, they all have guns, and they know what you've done.

Remember that house Daryl found in the woods? Turns out there's a lot of them and they are all occupied by people related to Hercshell.

Edited by Deadpelican, 31 December 2011 - 03:05 AM.

[Merle Dixon]

Deadpelican, on 31 December 2011 - 03:02 AM, said:

This is what I'd call "Shane logic." Impulsive. reckless and with zero thought to long- term consequences.  Yeah, they  could murder Herschell and his family and then, a week or so  later a dozen or so  people (with guns) show up at the farm claiming to be Herchell's extended family and want to know what the hell is going on because they haven't heard from Herschell and co. in over a week. Turns out, in fact that everyone living within a 30 mile radius is part of Herschell's extended family, they all have guns, and they know what you've done.

Remember that house Daryl found in the woods? Turns out there's a lot of them and they are all occupied by people related to Hercshell.

sounds EXTREMELY FUCKING FAR FETCHED to me. its a zombie apocalypse herschels family isnt gona come with guns lmfao this is just ridiculous. and OBVIOUSLY that house was abandoned. killing herschel and his family would be 100% best way of survival.

however i wouldnt do that at all. the 100% best way isnt always right. the 100% suvival mode mentality would kill off carl, sophia, lori, carol, probably dale, and herschel and his family. so theyres less need for food ect. but this way is just heartless and rediculious no regard for others. youd have to be a mentally ill lunatic to do that.