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Fear The Walking Dead Episode 408 ~ No One's Gone ~ Review


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Poll: episode 8 (26 member(s) have cast votes)

How do you rate this episode?

  1. Excellent (3 votes [11.54%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 11.54%

  2. Good (7 votes [26.92%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 26.92%

  3. Fair (8 votes [30.77%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 30.77%

  4. Poor (8 votes [30.77%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 30.77%

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#1
Bug

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Madison fights to preserve to protect the life she worked so hard to build.  Morgan tries to do the right thing.

 


Edited by Bug, 10 June 2018 - 08:22 PM.

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#2
Aolain

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Once again, hard for me to rate. Is it excellent? Perhaps. Is it fair? Maybe.

The biggest issue fir me is that Madison might be alive. What did she say at the end? Something to the effect that it isn't always over--badly paraphrased.

So, the inconclusive end of Madison is an issue for me. If I were to guess, she is still alive.
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#3
Dead Gov Walking

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I might be done watching this show. 


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#4
Deadpelican

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When a character is last seen in a situation that they could not possibly have survived- but we don't actually seem them die-  they usually end up reappearing.  I hope that's not the case with Madison.  Talking Dead seemed to confirm that she's really dead and I hope that's the case. 

 

Waiting until the very last episode to reveal what happened at the stadium was a mistake. What happened at the stadium influenced the behavior of all the characters there. Their behavior made no sense because the characters spent the whole first half of the season reacting to events that we had not seen yet. 

 

And the show went down the predictable route. 

 

In previous seasons she seemed to be evolving into an evil character.   But The Walking Dead universe  seems have a rule that says characters  become impossibly good and righteous just before being killed off. 

 

And so the rule was in full force here- for the umpteenth time. 

 

I think the best thing to do is announce season nine as the final season of The WalkingDead and cancel Fear as well. It's time to pack it in. 

 

Going out on top is no longer an option, but there is still a chance of  going  out before the shows become  a total joke. 


Edited by Deadpelican, 11 June 2018 - 05:10 AM.

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#5
Shape430

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So I finally got around to watching episodes 7 & 8 because honestly I stopped caring so much I forgot this show existed for a few weeks lol.

 

I'll say it again, I hate Madison's complete change in character from seasons 3 to 4, it's so dumb and makes little sense. And It's also  pretty likely she's alive now since we didn't "see" her die, but for me she died at the end of season 3.

 

As for Alisha getting talked down so easily, that was also stupid. Not to mention the fact that she wanted to kill "June" more then the little girl? The girl who killed her brother in cold blood? What? lol. I don't understand how that makes any sense but ok, guess we can't stay mad at her because shes a child and that would be bad :angel:   :smiley-confused002: . I honestly wish she would have just shot through pacifist Morgan and killed June, at least I wouldn't have been expecting that.

 

Also I wasn't too far off when I said they'd all be sitting around by a campfire by the end of this singing Kumbaya, while Strand happily serves the person who killed Nick in cold blood some food lol  :zombietongueout: :wallmad: , 

 

But yeah, overall I voted poor. I agree with the above poster who suggested they just cancel both shows before it gets any worse, if it actually can get any worse....  :zombiethumbsdown: :2206_mourning_over_dead_friend: . 


Edited by Shape430, 11 June 2018 - 10:14 AM.

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#6
bully8

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Just hated the ending.  It was so cheesy that it was far below my expectations, which were low already.  Although I have enjoyed the wild-eyed killer version of Alicia, her anger at Naomi (June?) doesn't seem realistic now that the story has been told.  Madison died (if she really died) more because of Alicia and Nick's poorly thought out rescue mission, rather than because of Naomi.

 

And speaking of Naomi, how many #*!@%$ names can one woman make up for herself?

 

I think it's going to be difficult for the remaining characters to carry this show.  I can't believe the writers wanted to swap Morgan for Madison.  Alicia has to be considered the lead character now, and I don't feel any chemistry or attachment between her and Strand.  And obviously much less to June, Althea, Morgan, or the little girl (Charlie?).  There's no chemistry between anybody except June and John.  OK, I guess Morgan and John have a little friendship going too.  So John, a guy who has been all alone for the whole ZA, is now closer to more people than anybody else?  Man, this show is screwed up.


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#7
Aolain

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I read elsewhere that TTD claims Madison is truly dead. That right?

If so, can we trust TTD?
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#8
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I voted Fair. There were, in fact, Excellent moments and also some very good ones, but there is enough confusion in the episode about a few things that it couldn't hold those ratings for me.

The Good:

Madison lead in story was done as a flashback but without us realizing it at the beginning. I was lead into the wondering what happened path and how everything was going to go when the two had that AHA moment only to find out I was having the moment. It was done well enough that it didn't piss me off after finding out like all the other flashbacks this season have. It also, at least tacitly, covered some of the missing time ground we NEED covered to move forward. We know they hopped around, that as of finding the stadium none of the fish-from-the-Dam people are around, and that they've been travelling and covering ground in a way that didn't really lead to a sudden Now-We're-Good-People change, but that it was gradual and Al was a tipping point of many. More of that instead of the flashback filming is what I was hoping the series would be like, but this was well filmed and executed by all involved.

It held me, in fact, until Nick walked out of the motel. I honestly thought it was all over and done until then. There is also a real comparison of the stadium to TWD prison in approach and how the characters view the respective new homes. I kind of found that symmetry to be a comfortable connection to the original show.

Morgan in the stadium is making the right and right for his character choices, finally being a little more like I want Morgan to be like. I didn't know if Alicia would pull the trigger or fake him out (Morgan is known for being faked out, after all) when he mentioned he stepped aside for Nick but won't for her. There were a lot of ways that could have gone down for the three of them. Also, Alicia's character struggled with it and was well acted. There was a subtle but there change in her expression after Morgan said that. The actress made sure her character had to process those words.

The Bad:

The whole stadium break out. There's a lot of confusion and maybe I wasn't watching closely but it left me with a lot of unanswered questions. Bad planning and strategy aside for a moment...the big character note was what I mentioned last week. Madison's leadership didn't offer a second in command or strong cohesive structure, and didn't engender trust or faith in her decisions. So when the panic hit, they all became scared individuals without leadership. She was never meant to lead but insisted on doing it, and not allowing a second in command to be assertive in her absence. THIS is the single largest (and despite all the things the Vultures tried to do, the only serious one) contribution to the fall of the stadium.

Back to the bad. I was left wondering...did the stadium people escape? I thought it was a no and overrun but then Madison sacrificed herself to get some or just her family out. Still...no overrun escape vehicles when Al came back to the stadium in the lot...no remnants.

Did the vultures get over run, killed, or flee? I know some made it out but not all. Their tactics and planning seems ridiculous at this point, and I can't make heads or tails of it. That's a big loose end I have to review episodes from before to piece together, and frankly I don't care enough to do that, so I'm asking here. I know the one guy grabbed the little girl and left, but this is all confusing to me. If the Vultures have done this before you would think it wouldn't go so south so fast for them.

Madison's last line tells me that she's still alive somewhere waiting for a season finale or something to come back into. Flare distracts walkers, fire creates more stimulus, Madison climbs fence and shimmies to a high spot or runs, probably breaking the radio or losing it is my guess. Tune in later for the explanation.

I don't see Strand being forgiving or less conniving because of this story line. He's too two-faced for what I saw at the end of the episode.

Anyways, despite all the amazing things there script wise, acting, and visually, these baffling little plot things kind of lowered the bar for me to Fair. Now we have some good characters who I LIKE to watch being added to the mix, so I am looking forward to the next episode. Al, John, Whatever-Her-Name-Is-This-Week are great characters. Morgan has been kinda hot and cold so far, but at least he's warming up from the coldest.


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#9
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They know what they're told...and in the absence of direct answers what they are told to tell...

Read into Dumpster Glenn for how that goes.

 

I read elsewhere that TTD claims Madison is truly dead. That right?

If so, can we trust TTD?


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#10
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What I see in this show, or more specifically what is missing in the show, is the lack of cohesion to keep us interested.

TWD was about Rick. The comic was (moment of honesty, I haven't really read it), the show despite it's alterations is. He's what we stake ourselves to every show to see how he's changing, what is going on in his world, and how his world interacts, effects, and is effected by, the other characters.

FTWD does not have that. They pushed ensemble too far from the first episode, so we never latched onto the strong lead character, we didn't know enough about them or their lives to care. Without that bonding the show can't find it's footing. Is Nick the primary character? Travis? Madison? seasons progress and we get somewhere, but we don't learn to care because we never stay with the one grounding character to grow and live through. We just did a whole season without Madison but we claim the show was about Madison...now we're lead to believe she's dead?

If we can't root into a character or show, then we can't identify with them, can't put ourselves in their shoes and question what we would do.

You see, we need a primary character to plant our roots with, not too many characters to pick from. In TWD you knew, even without comic knowledge, who the main character was, and who the sidekicks were. Maybe we didn't know which of them would move on, die, or become more important than others, but we got the basics. I feel like this show dropped that ball within an episode or two.

Just my humble .02.

 

Just hated the ending.  It was so cheesy that it was far below my expectations, which were low already.  Although I have enjoyed the wild-eyed killer version of Alicia, her anger at Naomi (June?) doesn't seem realistic now that the story has been told.  Madison died (if she really died) more because of Alicia and Nick's poorly thought out rescue mission, rather than because of Naomi.

 

And speaking of Naomi, how many #*!@%$ names can one woman make up for herself?

 

I think it's going to be difficult for the remaining characters to carry this show.  I can't believe the writers wanted to swap Morgan for Madison.  Alicia has to be considered the lead character now, and I don't feel any chemistry or attachment between her and Strand.  And obviously much less to June, Althea, Morgan, or the little girl (Charlie?).  There's no chemistry between anybody except June and John.  OK, I guess Morgan and John have a little friendship going too.  So John, a guy who has been all alone for the whole ZA, is now closer to more people than anybody else?  Man, this show is screwed up.


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#11
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I've yet to watch the last one and haven't watched this one yet. 

I'm one of the ones who has really liked this season a lot, and I'm putting off things as they seem to be slipping and both persons who loved this season and loathed it are agreeing. 

I usually watch late, so I sometimes hop on here and check the votes. No spoilers, just see who liked and who didn't. I often know what I'm likely to think that why. I told my wife the last episode was unpopular with basically everyone so we decided to skip it for now. 

I will catch up and I am somehow hoping you all are wrong. :)

But I've a feeling things are getting Gimpled. 


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#12
Pickles312

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Season 3 was super promising and then this season has absolutely torched the show. Nick and Madison in a half season? Jumbled garbage the whole way through with flashbacks and forwards spoiling and ruining every important moment. Character's motivations not making any sense with their characters. All plot points from previous seasons abandoned with no explanation. Cinematography that is over edited, over dramatic, and absolutely terribly executed. I've like a couple of the new characters, but not at the expense of everything they've built.

 

The new creative team ruined this show. Clearly this was just some kind of power trip. I'll keep watching cause I have nothing better to do, but to be honest I only care about Strand's character at this point. Alicia and Luciana have always been shells to me, so to see them as the only other survivors is just stupid.


Edited by Pickles312, 11 June 2018 - 05:08 PM.

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#13
bully8

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What I see in this show, or more specifically what is missing in the show, is the lack of cohesion to keep us interested.

TWD was about Rick. The comic was (moment of honesty, I haven't really read it), the show despite it's alterations is. He's what we stake ourselves to every show to see how he's changing, what is going on in his world, and how his world interacts, effects, and is effected by, the other characters.

FTWD does not have that. They pushed ensemble too far from the first episode, so we never latched onto the strong lead character, we didn't know enough about them or their lives to care. Without that bonding the show can't find it's footing. Is Nick the primary character? Travis? Madison? seasons progress and we get somewhere, but we don't learn to care because we never stay with the one grounding character to grow and live through. We just did a whole season without Madison but we claim the show was about Madison...now we're lead to believe she's dead?

If we can't root into a character or show, then we can't identify with them, can't put ourselves in their shoes and question what we would do.

You see, we need a primary character to plant our roots with, not too many characters to pick from. In TWD you knew, even without comic knowledge, who the main character was, and who the sidekicks were. Maybe we didn't know which of them would move on, die, or become more important than others, but we got the basics. I feel like this show dropped that ball within an episode or two.

Just my humble .02.

 

Even worse, I looks like we will be expected to accept that Alicia, Luciana, and Strand have joined up with the armored car group that they were just trying to kill.

 

This show tends introduce, develop, and then kill off large numbers of characters.  Alicia and Strand are the only original characters left.  The carnage tends to lead to exactly what you are saying.


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#14
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Season 3 was super promising and then this season has absolutely torched the show. Nick and Madison in a half season? Jumbled garbage the whole way through with flashbacks and forwards spoiling and ruining every important moment. Character's motivations not making any sense with their characters. All plot points from previous seasons abandoned with no explanation. Cinematography that is over edited, over dramatic, and absolutely terribly executed. I've like a couple of the new characters, but not at the expense of everything they've built.

 

The new creative team ruined this show. Clearly this was just some kind of power trip. I'll keep watching cause I have nothing better to do, but to be honest I only care about Strand's character at this point. Alicia and Luciana have always been shells to me, so to see them as the only other survivors is just stupid.

 

Remember all the sites hyping up the series leading up to this season? 'Fear started off slow, but really found its grove in Season 3! It's really great now and you should check it out!'

 

If only they knew.


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#15
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Good.

 

I actually liked this one. I mean, I'm rewatching it right now to find something to complain about, but reaching the end of this madness is a boon. Good moments between John, Nao... Lau... June. We call her June now. Hmm. Vultures are dead, we finally have a group that doesn't piss me off with how mysterious they are, the time-jumping seems to be at an end. Morgan's still crippled and John's still got a bullet in his side and the SWAT truck's... toast...

 

I think the only thing that stands out to me right now is how it's kind of a dick move to kill Madison off. From what I understand, her actress pulled herself out of a lousy financial situation thanks to this show.

 

It's also a weird coincidence that Madison, arguably the main character, is getting killed off around the same time as Rick is allegedly leaving TWD. I mean what were the odds.


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#16
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I wonder if those who say they're done with the show, who funnily enough are the same ones that have been done with TWD for years, will actually be done with the show.

 

The answer is no. Was it a fantastic episode. No. Was it a terrible episode. No. It was an interesting, well written and well acted episode that ended some story arcs, and open a few more.

 

Sorry to see Madison go, but will be interesting to see how the new group of characters develop, as  well as Alicia who seems to be the main protagonist with Strand.

 

Also I may have missed something....but where's Salazar?


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#17
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Overall I voted good. I think because the layout of the show was a little more coherent.

But story wise, this show is in pure chaos.

There is no one I can root for now.  They killed off the main character and the most interesting one in the same year in ridiculously lazy ways.

I can't imagine this show lasting another season to be honest.

 

But on a side note.  Everyone was sure crazy to kill JUNE.  Did I miss something?  Was the only thing she did was leave after she thought everyone had died and joined the vultures?

If so damm, their response of going all out murder seemed to be a little bit of a an overkill.  :)


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#18
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I liked this episode for the emotion and the acting, and at last the story sort of makes sense. The mystery is solved. 

 

The scenes in the van were good, and I like the chemistry between June and John (oh, the alliteration!) and the bromance between John and Morgan.  Morgan is one of my favourite characters so I enjoyed seeming him talk Alicia down; I felt that Debnam-Carey was excellent, particularly in that scene.But why didn't Strand or Lucianna kill Naomi as she emerged from the tunnel?  Morgan hadn't worked his magic on them.

 

Madison's end was bit smaltzy but they were giving the character and the actress a big sendoff.  In the end, it looked like the three survivors of the stadium were burned out and perhaps realizing that their vengeance had achieved nothing and almost killed several innocent people.  Plus there was no one else to kill, unless someone was going to shoot a ten year old girl who had reacted violently to seeing her father substitute murdered. I wonder if Charlie will be part of the group from now on.  I hope so.

 

I do very much dislike the killing off of Madison.  Fear has always been her story, not that of Travis or Nick.  It's just very unusual for a series of this kind to to feature a middle-aged woman as its primary protagonist.  I didn't particularly like Madison, and was reminded of why when she attacked Althea.  However it seems that it took her interaction with Al, fundamentally a decent person who seems to be holding on to that, to complete the change in Madison that I thought began as she was drowning at the dam.  Madison was always interesting and this season I was starting to like her a little more. 

 

Fear is scarcely recognizable now with Madison gone and only Alicia and Victor left from S1. This is a huge reboot, more than I ever dreamed, and I wonder why.  I thought that last season of Fear was very good.  One of the complaints I heard from people who abandoned the series early on was that none of the characters were likable or relatable and I agreed,  Perhaps the producers are trying to fix that.   

 

We saw a recap of what the Clarks' lives were like after the dam until they got to the stadium.  I suspect that's all we're going to get.  Salazar comes and goes, probably in accordance with Blades recording and performing schedule, but it's hard to see where Daniel would fit in now.  Do they need still another middle-aged guy?  

 

I agree that the battle at the  stadium was confusing.  I had to watch it again after hearing the recap by Alicia, Victor and Lucianna and it's still not very clear.  Maybe the producers didn't have enough money to mount a big spectacle and had to substitute arty shots and slo-mo.  Killing off all the extras and bit players so conveniently reminded me of the prison on TWD, as well as Lost.  

 

Did anyone else think that the burned walkers attacking the SWAT van looked like people in grey leotards and masks?

 

txpoc, I thought that Alicia believed that Naomi had always been with the Vultures, had infiltrated the stadium like Charlie and so was also responsible for Madison's death.  


Edited by Nareen, 12 June 2018 - 12:59 PM.

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#19
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This episode struck me as a situation where the story was too big for the budget. The way they filmed the big stadium battle was kind of lame, with the cast trading lines like they were reading poetry.

It was a good decision to turn over the cast to more likable characters. But now that the sequence of events this season has been pieced together, I can’t make any sense out of it.

What were the Vultures waiting for? If the group starved out, what of sufficient importance to camp out there would be left?

What was the endgame for the Vulture brother after they’d sent the zombie bomb into the stadium? Seems like the only point was to kill them. They clearly didn’t loot it after. So...what is their goal?

The run-in between Nick and that Zombie brother when he was loading pimentos...how does that make any sense? Of course Nick would want to kill him. The idea that this guy would just go on loading and put himself in such a vulnerable position...I don’t understand it.

I almost feel like they started the season planning to tell one story, then changed their minds part-way through. Anyway, I find the whole thing to make less sense now that they’ve filled it in more.
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#20
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This episode struck me as a situation where the story was too big for the budget. The way they filmed the big stadium battle was kind of lame, with the cast trading lines like they were reading poetry.

It was a good decision to turn over the cast to more likable characters. But now that the sequence of events this season has been pieced together, I can’t make any sense out of it.

What were the Vultures waiting for? If the group starved out, what of sufficient importance to camp out there would be left?

What was the endgame for the Vulture brother after they’d sent the zombie bomb into the stadium? Seems like the only point was to kill them. They clearly didn’t loot it after. So...what is their goal?

The run-in between Nick and that Zombie brother when he was loading pimentos...how does that make any sense? Of course Nick would want to kill him. The idea that this guy would just go on loading and put himself in such a vulnerable position...I don’t understand it.

I almost feel like they started the season planning to tell one story, then changed their minds part-way through. Anyway, I find the whole thing to make less sense now that they’ve filled it in more.

 

"This episode struck me as a situation where the story was too big for the budget" hits the nail on the head, IMO.

 

My understanding was that it was Madison who drew the walkers en masse into the stadium with her torch so her kids in the parking lot could get away, leaving the place infested.  Maybe the Vultures' plan was that fear of the dead would drive the occupants to flee but leave the stadium intact.  Just a guess, because the plan certainly isn't clear to me.

 

Since Frank Dillane asked to be released last year and Kim Dickens was told before filming started on this season that she was going too, I suspect the plan was set before then,  I really liked this season up until episode 7 so I still have hope . 

 

It's ironic that just as Madison is becoming more likable they kill her off.


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#21
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My fears about the way they chose to tell the story this season were realized. It was anti-climatic. We had pretty much figured out that Madison was dead. They chose to give us this huge build up to the stadium's downfall. Taking 8 episodes to dole out tiny pieces of the story and then to finally give it to us and do it by giving us second hand stories and slo mo flashes of what happened felt incredibly cheap. It actually felt like an insult to the lead actress.

June's story of how she hooked up with the Vultures made little sense. But, then again, nothing about the way all of the character's reacted to the zombie truck bombs made sense. It seemed like the entire plot was; stupidity ensues.

 

We are left with many unanswered questions. We still don't know why Nic went from a being on dangerous self-destructive streak to Farmer Nick (Gimple's huge fingerprint). Last season, Nic was willing to be tortured by Salazar to protect a sociopath (Troy) and was eating zombie brains. 

Speaking of Salazar, we didn't even get a glimpse of where he is at. TPTB have to know that he is fan favorite. 


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#22
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Good points!  Salazar not only is a fan favorite but he may be the only fan favorite and he isnt even on the show. 

At least they didn't kill him off by having an anvil fall on him from the sky or something silly...... yet   :}


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#23
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 TPTB have to know that he is fan favorite. 

 

 

As you are aware, there was a shakeup behind the scenes.  I can't remember the names involved, but I'm fairly certain that TPTB this season are a completely different set of people. 

 

And from what I've seen, they just don't seem to give a damn about the show's established fan base or who their favorites are. From the first episode, if felt as if they were scrapping everything that had come before and rebooting the show for an entirely different audience.

 

It wouldn't surprise me if Salazaar was never seen or heard from again. And yeah, that would awful, but I wouldn't put it past the bunch who is currently running this show. 


Edited by Deadpelican, 14 June 2018 - 11:02 PM.

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#24
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I finally have caught up again.

This episode was far better than the last, in large part to my acceptance that the stadium story will end with terrible writing. Knowing this, I choose to rate this episode with the past transgressions of TPTB as punished. The character work in this episode was better than the last episode, and the dialog was much improved (Strand wasn't given terrible lines this time).

I am surprised so many people are surprised there isn't a vendetta against Charlie. She's a child, and she just had her caregiver killed. She's a child, and she'd been used to facilitate the survival plans (as inane as they are) of her care givers. It might be hard to keep her around, but killing her would be tough.

The desperate desire to kill June was dumb from the beginning and now that her 'crime' was revealed it becomes impossibly stupid. Given that it was always dumb- discovering that her crime was continuing to choose to live is forgivable.

Remembering that all of these people have seen and done horrific things, forgiveness of evil may come as easily as an act of evil. Hard perhaps, but easier than it would be for all of us watching.

Getting together instantly over home movies, fireside stories, and noodles is truly silly, but it remains possible that going forward will be rocky for awhile yet. But surviving together as a group? I can handle that.

I never saw Madison as the main character. My theory from the beginning was that Nick and Alicia were always going to be the stars. That Madison and Travis were there to give the kids something to bounce off of as they fully mature in this brutal world. As they mold Madison's stoic calculation and Travis's committed 'good-will-triumph' into a mindset that will see them move forward successfully.

Nick leaving changes that, but since I always saw this as a hand-off in the waiting losing Madison neither surprises nor upsets me. Losing her this way does.

I loved her scenes with the journalist. Madison's best moment of acting actually. Her send off was a bit over the top to be a success, though.  The character deserved more. Or less- I liked Travis's very surprising exit. Of course, the rules of tv mean that Madison is alive, since no death was witnessed. So who knows.

So when I accept as already addressed and punished the especially stupid stadium vs. vultures storyline, I will actually change my vote from fair to good. It wasn't good, but if I continue to punish the show for the previous episode's crime this show will never be good again. Like no word on Salazar or anything post dam. It's a mistake, but not THIS episode's mistake.


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#25
ricky311

ricky311

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I haven't reviewed a single episode since the first one this season, because I wanted to see how the season played out before I formed my opinion.

FTWD, imo, and everything the first three seasons have been building up to has been destroyed. Every major plot progression reeks off "behind the scenes decisions" instead of feeling like natural progressions.

The way they rebooted Madison's character was stupid. Someone hands her a box with food and suddenly she wants to save the world? This is not Madison.

Killing her off feels more like a decision of the new TPTB to attempt to make the show more appealing to a younger audience than the bs "ripple effect" her death would have on the other characters. Dickens was fired. Thing is, the fact that this show was fronted by a middle aged, strong woman was one of it's strengths.

Why did they even bother to bring back Luciana? She was T-Dog this season, only with a few more lines. Her character has had no actual interaction with the main story, which makes me think she was only added because of the reason mentioned above.

Morgan is also annoying the F out of me with every single line he gets. Him talking Alicia out of shooting June was absolute unbelievable garbage. Morgan was just added to increase ratings, but also as a plot device to help derive the leftover characters from their villain paths. He has literally done nothing else in the entire 8 episodes than bitch about wanting to be alone and bitch about his all life is precious bs.

They should have stuck with Dave Erickson's original plan where Madison was becoming more and more of a villain. Then eventually, Morgan would have fitted in more naturally.

I wish he hadn't left the show and Gimple never got involved. Meh.

The stadium scenes were shot so confusing, probably to work around budget issues, that I never really got the feeling that Madison (or anyone else outside of the car the kids were trapped in) was in any danger. There was way too much closeup and slow-mo for me to comprehend the situation. I watched it twice to see if it wasn't me, but no...

Meh. I will watch the ms premiere, but I have very low expectations and I'm starting to consider giving up on the TWD universe alltogether. Especially now that it looks like Morgan will be the lead.

MORGAN? Like, why didn't they just leave this show alone (or even cancel it ffs) and make an entirely new spin-off on Morgan and the new characters? Alicia is the only Clark left, the only character left from episode 1, the only character that's had some serious development, and they pick Morgan? If it will turn out to be the Morgan show, I am not going to make it until the season finale.
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