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Morgan: Because All Life Is Precious

Morgan Terminus Church

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#1
DeadCave

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Season five's final episode had Morgan answering Daryl's question of "Why?" (save their lives), with "because all life is precious Daryl." 
I can't help but wonder how Morgan would've felt about that sentiment had he been to Terminus or even at the Church, knowing what those people were and capable of doing. 
I'm guessing that he would be disagreeing with Rick on his statement, "they don't get to live." But would he? 
Say, that he was among the captives in boxcar A and then lined up with Rick, Daryl, Bob and Glenn at the slaughtering. Perhaps even replacing Bob as there were "4 from A and 4 from B". Being at the end of the line, watching the slaughter begin. Would he have changed his mind about killing living persons? I would imagine him trying to plead with Gareth like Bob did, but would he just want escape or be willing to kill to be free? 
We'll probably never know for sure but I'm just curious what others here think. 

 

 


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#2
kombat

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It's a stupid sentiment in the first place since it's simply not true, at least when talking about human life. And especially in their situation where it is everyone or group for themselves. The wolves tried to kill him. To let them live was just stupid, no other way to put it. You don't know if they'll come back for you and with greater numbers next time, or if they'll do the same thing to the next people they run across.


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#3
hazmat

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It's a stupid sentiment in the first place since it's simply not true, at least when talking about human life. And especially in their situation where it is everyone or group for themselves. The wolves tried to kill him. To let them live was just stupid, no other way to put it. You don't know if they'll come back for you and with greater numbers next time, or if they'll do the same thing to the next people they run across.

 

Agree, but didn't he blow a car horn after he took out those two Wolves? Presumably, that was to attract walkers and allow them to do the dirty work, I can't think of any other reason he'd do it. So perhaps the "all life is precious" thing is the mantra that gets him through, so while he may not be willing to take a living human life, he's okay with using walkers(or other means that are not his own hands) to do so. Just me blathering...


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#4
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Agree, but didn't he blow a car horn after he took out those two Wolves? Presumably, that was to attract walkers and allow them to do the dirty work, I can't think of any other reason he'd do it. So perhaps the "all life is precious" thing is the mantra that gets him through, so while he may not be willing to take a living human life, he's okay with using walkers(or other means that are not his own hands) to do so. Just me blathering...

Lennie James said on the Talking Dead show that he blew the horn to make sure that no walkers were in the area. He didn't want to kill them. 

 

I think we will get a flashback episode which may explain when he started to change his philosophy. I am very interested in seeing what caused a very different shift in his personality.


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#5
hazmat

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Ah. I don't get to see Talking Dead, so I didn't know about that.


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#6
DominusPisces

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He only believes that because the writers need a counterpoint to Rick's..... 'proactive pragmatism'.

The reality of all life being precious would be to defend it and show restraint with taking life, and only doing so when no other choice.
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#7
hannsg

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What he means is that in a post industrial age of the ZA, humans are far more valuable as slaves than dead.

Human slaves are now a valuable commodity = all life is precious

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 


#8
GirlsDeadMonster

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I can see where Morgan is coming from. He watched his son be killed by his dead wife, whom he himself couldn't kill which ultimately lead to his son's death. I'm sure he felt enough guilt for several lifetimes. He already went through his "I hate this world and everyone in it" phase and this seems to be the next step. Acceptance. I don't think it means that he would never kill a human but I think he would chose to spare lives when he can. 


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#9
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My guess is that he attacked and lost to whoever taught him to wield his stick. The Stranger(David Carradine walking the earth, getting into adventures...) having spared Morgan, gains his trust and converts him to a new mindset. 


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#10
leegreenman

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I can see where Morgan is coming from. He watched his son be killed by his dead wife, whom he himself couldn't kill which ultimately lead to his son's death. I'm sure he felt enough guilt for several lifetimes. He already went through his "I hate this world and everyone in it" phase and this seems to be the next step. Acceptance. I don't think it means that he would never kill a human but I think he would chose to spare lives when he can. 


Agreed. He just places a high value on life. He also probably believes that the decision to kill results in a karmic debt which one inevitably will need to repay. If has to kill, he will, but only if other options don't exist.
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#11
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My thoughts on Morgan blowing the car horn after tying up the two wolves and stacking them in the backseat of the car. Was to attract walkers to the car, but for the purpose of keeping the wolves IN the car, while he made his get-away. Granted the two were unconscious at the time and he could've put a good distance between him and the two, having walkers surround the car (like it was for Daryl and Aaron), thus extending the time to increase the distance between them. I would've done the same. The two would eventually work themselves free but would then be faced with the possibility of being surrounded by walkers and no easy way out. 
Of course we now see the Wolves are not afraid of walkers and apparently have their own way of dealing with them, and thus the plan to keep the two trapped in the car would have failed... which we see when they killed the guy in the Red Poncho, later on. 


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#12
zack

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Has Morgan ever killed a human?  I don't remember him doing anything but putting down walkers. I know that he attacked Rick, Carl and Michonne in "Clear", but that didn't work out too well for him.  It will be interesting to see his back story.


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#13
Nareen

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Has Morgan ever killed a human?  I don't remember him doing anything but putting down walkers. I know that he attacked Rick, Carl and Michonne in "Clear", but that didn't work out too well for him.  It will be interesting to see his back story.

 

In Clear, the implication was that Morgan had been killing anyone who arrived in the town, at least that's how I took it..   That may or may not be so but Morgan also told Rick that both of them were killers when they were moving Pete's body.


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#14
zack

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In Clear, the implication was that Morgan had been killing anyone who arrived in the town, at least that's how I took it..   That may or may not be so but Morgan also told Rick that both of them were killers when they were moving Pete's body.

Thanks, it's been a while since I watched Clear.  Also forgot that Morgan said that to Rick.


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#15
NaarioDaharis

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I actually thought Morgan honked the horn to bring the Wolves' friends into the area to find them.

 

Leaving them alive will cause a lot more pain and suffering. That's on Morgan's head. The assault on Alexandria tonight could have been prevented by him. 


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#16
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Question is...if he meets up with those two again, what would he do THIS time?
More car horns...or his ninja stick through thier eye?
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#17
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I actually thought Morgan honked the horn to bring the Wolves' friends into the area to find them.

 

Leaving them alive will cause a lot more pain and suffering. That's on Morgan's head. The assault on Alexandria tonight could have been prevented by him. 

 

By this Logic, since Glenn spared Nick... does Glenn get the credit if Nick saves someone's life? People are only responsible for their own actions, not the actions of other adults.


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#18
NaarioDaharis

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By this Logic, since Glenn spared Nick... does Glenn get the credit if Nick saves someone's life? People are only responsible for their own actions, not the actions of other adults.

 

"By this logic," like, "What if," generally ends in irrelevancy. 


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#19
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By this Logic, since Glenn spared Nick... does Glenn get the credit if Nick saves someone's life? People are only responsible for their own actions, not the actions of other adults.

Well yeeeaah, that IS true. But recall in season 3 ep. 2 (Sick), that Rick didn't double check to see if Andrew was killed by the walkers in the prison. Thus his revenge later caused Lori's death. There is also the leaving the Terminus survivors alive, which allowed Gareth and company to threaten the group again. 
Ok, maybe Rick wasn't directly responsible for the actions of the aforementioned characters, but by not "taking care of them" as he should've, they wreaked havoc with the group. Same with Morgan not killing the wolves when he had the chance and the guy in the red poncho got killed, and the wolves are likely responsible for the horn being blown in the last episode. 
By not taking responsibility over others who have proven themselves dangerous, some responsibility for their subsequent actions must be assumed. 
Or am I wrong about this? 


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#20
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Morgan thy new name is edging around Tyrese.  It isn't good to be Tyrese.  It is wonderful to see your Jedi skills in action but the wolves lives aren't precious.  Wake up PLEAZ.


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#21
NaarioDaharis

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Tyreese was a pretty boring character. We don't need a constant "moral compass" character for Rick. He has a great idea about what things are. 

 

Now, Morgan is going to be another made-up boring character who could have been great. I'm sorry, but their made up characters, for some reason especially the African American ones, not being racist its just true, usually turn out to be terribly boring.

 

T-Dog, prison guy, Noah, Beth, Tyreese, Sasha, their version of the Governor, Andrea (cause she's not like comic Andrea), etc.

 

I know some (or a lot) of people liked a few of these characters, but really the comic versions were better. I'm not pro-comics. Its just true.


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#22
DominusPisces

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Well yeeeaah, that IS true. But recall in season 3 ep. 2 (Sick), that Rick didn't double check to see if Andrew was killed by the walkers in the prison. Thus his revenge later caused Lori's death. There is also the leaving the Terminus survivors alive, which allowed Gareth and company to threaten the group again. 
Ok, maybe Rick wasn't directly responsible for the actions of the aforementioned characters, but by not "taking care of them" as he should've, they wreaked havoc with the group. Same with Morgan not killing the wolves when he had the chance and the guy in the red poncho got killed, and the wolves are likely responsible for the horn being blown in the last episode. 
By not taking responsibility over others who have proven themselves dangerous, some responsibility for their subsequent actions must be assumed. 
Or am I wrong about this? 

There is something to be said about predicting foreseeable outcomes, and yes I concede some people should have been killed when the chance presented itself. Though I should point out, Andrew and the Terminians don't count in this case. Andrew was assumed killed by Walker. This wasn't Rick deliberately sparing his life. Additionally, after Terminus the group simply didn't have the ability to pursue an engagement at that point. Rick would have been stupid to chase after Andrew into the yard. And it would have been suicide to go after the Terminians into a huge horde after being malnourished, exhausted and no where near focused. These were. These were both the best decisions at the time and simply didn't pan out.

 

Morgan sparing the Wolves, Glenn sparing Nick and even the group accepting Tara into their fold are evidence of what we are talking about. Nick and Tara proved to be correct. (Though.. Nick might get someone killed due to a mistake, I doubt he has malicious goals against Glenn. As far as not killing the wolves. I agree that would not be the choice I would make, but being that they threatened Morgan's life, he alone had a right to determine what the crime against him was worth. In the end he choose his convictions. Which is probably what is keeping him from going back to a raving lunatic. 

Allot of people have condemned Rick for 'killing' Hitchhiker, or condemn Carol for letting Hippie Chick getting killed, by suggesting they go out and scavenge. The reality is, is that Hitchhiker was responsible only for himself, Rick was under no obligation to extend his strained resources to anyone. Same thing with the Hippie Couple. They decided they could go out, despite being half crippled and... self admittingly incompetent. If Rick and Carol are not to blame for these deaths, then Morgan is not guilty of any crimes someone else does.

 

 

Morgan thy new name is edging around Tyrese.  It isn't good to be Tyrese.  It is wonderful to see your Jedi skills in action but the wolves lives aren't precious.  Wake up PLEAZ.

 

Different entirely. Tyrese was paralyzed into inaction. Morgan is deliberately choosing his. Tyrese was simply broken and unable to function in this world. Morgan found himself a belief to keep himself sane. I might not agree with it, but it's completely different than what happened with Ty.

 

Tyreese was a pretty boring character. We don't need a constant "moral compass" character for Rick. He has a great idea about what things are. 

 

Now, Morgan is going to be another made-up boring character who could have been great. I'm sorry, but their made up characters, for some reason especially the African American ones, not being racist its just true, usually turn out to be terribly boring.

 

T-Dog, prison guy, Noah, Beth, Tyreese, Sasha, their version of the Governor, Andrea (cause she's not like comic Andrea), etc.

 

I know some (or a lot) of people liked a few of these characters, but really the comic versions were better. I'm not pro-comics. Its just true.

Actually... you do. I'm not even talking about a 'real world' scenario. It's simply good story-telling. In a group you need internal as well as external strife. If everyone was on the same page THEN it becomes boring. We all like to say RickCo and Ricktatorship, but the reality is... if the characters all really completely agreed with Rick, they cease becoming characters and simply become extensions of Rick's character. 

Some characters they botched. There's no question. T-Dog and Beth didn't get used until they were offed, which was a shame, because when they showed us what they could have been from the start, it was awesome. TV Andrea... was an abomination that was "Abhorrent in the eyes of our Lord" worthy. (In fact I'm sure she was banned somewhere in Commandments 11-15 that Moses dropped). That doesn't change the fact that characters like Ty were well written. Characters that lose their drive and will are going to happen. It's a reality,and too watch him go from a guy who raged uncontrollably to a lost puppy paralyzed with inaction was tragic, but in a good way. The only problem with this was they picked a bad-ass from the comic, but as a stand alone character TV Tyresse worked. 

If everyone became Rick Clones then the show just.. devolves into pointless action, because there's no character building. Even among soldiers in the same unit you would have differing opinions by this point if a squad survived together. 


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Now I lay me down to sleep, I pray thee Lord these bites aren't deep.
Should I die before I wake, I pray thee Lord, my skull they break.


#23
NaarioDaharis

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There is something to be said about predicting foreseeable outcomes, and yes I concede some people should have been killed when the chance presented itself. Though I should point out, Andrew and the Terminians don't count in this case. Andrew was assumed killed by Walker. This wasn't Rick deliberately sparing his life. Additionally, after Terminus the group simply didn't have the ability to pursue an engagement at that point. Rick would have been stupid to chase after Andrew into the yard. And it would have been suicide to go after the Terminians into a huge horde after being malnourished, exhausted and no where near focused. These were. These were both the best decisions at the time and simply didn't pan out.

 

Morgan sparing the Wolves, Glenn sparing Nick and even the group accepting Tara into their fold are evidence of what we are talking about. Nick and Tara proved to be correct. (Though.. Nick might get someone killed due to a mistake, I doubt he has malicious goals against Glenn. As far as not killing the wolves. I agree that would not be the choice I would make, but being that they threatened Morgan's life, he alone had a right to determine what the crime against him was worth. In the end he choose his convictions. Which is probably what is keeping him from going back to a raving lunatic. 

Allot of people have condemned Rick for 'killing' Hitchhiker, or condemn Carol for letting Hippie Chick getting killed, by suggesting they go out and scavenge. The reality is, is that Hitchhiker was responsible only for himself, Rick was under no obligation to extend his strained resources to anyone. Same thing with the Hippie Couple. They decided they could go out, despite being half crippled and... self admittingly incompetent. If Rick and Carol are not to blame for these deaths, then Morgan is not guilty of any crimes someone else does.

 

 

 

Different entirely. Tyrese was paralyzed into inaction. Morgan is deliberately choosing his. Tyrese was simply broken and unable to function in this world. Morgan found himself a belief to keep himself sane. I might not agree with it, but it's completely different than what happened with Ty.

 

Actually... you do. I'm not even talking about a 'real world' scenario. It's simply good story-telling. In a group you need internal as well as external strife. If everyone was on the same page THEN it becomes boring. We all like to say RickCo and Ricktatorship, but the reality is... if the characters all really completely agreed with Rick, they cease becoming characters and simply become extensions of Rick's character. 

Some characters they botched. There's no question. T-Dog and Beth didn't get used until they were offed, which was a shame, because when they showed us what they could have been from the start, it was awesome. TV Andrea... was an abomination that was "Abhorrent in the eyes of our Lord" worthy. (In fact I'm sure she was banned somewhere in Commandments 11-15 that Moses dropped). That doesn't change the fact that characters like Ty were well written. Characters that lose their drive and will are going to happen. It's a reality,and too watch him go from a guy who raged uncontrollably to a lost puppy paralyzed with inaction was tragic, but in a good way. The only problem with this was they picked a bad-ass from the comic, but as a stand alone character TV Tyresse worked. 

If everyone became Rick Clones then the show just.. devolves into pointless action, because there's no character building. Even among soldiers in the same unit you would have differing opinions by this point if a squad survived together. 

Everyone doesn't have to agree with Rick. But people need to intelligently argue with him. Morgan is ridiculous. And I'm not sure what Michonne's deal with him is because she's been there with him and really he hasn't acted too strange toward the Alexandrians. She just disagrees with him out of character so that there will be some tension.

 

Tyreese had no point. That whole "gotta pay the toll" or whatever bull all the dead characters kept saying at his death scene didn't mean anything. They had no idea what they were doing with the character and just killed him off. 


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#24
leegreenman

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His belief that all life is precious isn't crazy. He believes people can "come back" if given a chance. He, in his own words, is a "killer" but came back. It's a classic nature vs nurture argument. He believes that people are essentially good, but are driven to evil by the world. I'm not saying I agree, but it fits the character, and contrasts well with Rick and Carol.
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#25
NaarioDaharis

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But when people are being butchered in the streets, you don't stop to tie one up for 10 minutes so that you can help him "come back."


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