Thieves: Kill, Punish Or Mercy?

- - - - - Noah Season 5

#51
DominusPisces

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I had a feeling I was missing a reference. I even googled it and nothing came up. :D

Now I get it. :blush:

:::Pats head::::   ;) 


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#52
Thanos

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I would kill every person not already in the group I came in contact with. I would not greet them, in fact, the less they see my group or me, the better. Shooting them in the back is the best way. Never let them see you.



Wow that's a bit hardcore the more of you the better how many lone wolves have we seen in 5 seasons ?
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#53
moop420

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This is another reason why this episode should have come before Beth's episode. I feel cheated already knowing that Noah is at the very least a decent guy. I also knew there would be no chance either Daryl or Carol would end up leaving Noah trapped under the shelving.

 

To answer your question: If I were in Daryl's situation I would have left Noah to die too. He stole from me, left me for dead, so I'd do the same to him. However, knowing what I know about Noah as a viewer, I would have spared him.

 

Interestingly, on the surface Noah is similar to Sam/gimpy chick in that he appears to be more of a liability than an asset. Kind of a nice full circle thing there with Carol being the one to save him and all after basically telling Rick that Sam/gimpy chick weren't worth saving last season.


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#54
nazacuckoo

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If the guy was walking away with my stuff, and I had the chance to shoot him and get my stuff back, I'd take the shot.

BUT! If I managed to find him again, and disarm him, (As Carol and Daryl did) I'd let him go. I might punch him around a bit, but I wouldn't want

to kill him unless it's completely necessary. I guess I'm a little soft.

However, I'd make sure he was far away from me before I went on my way. I'd probably order him to walk out of sight before I started moving.


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"There's no "I" in team" 

"Yeah, there's no "U" either. So I guess if I'm not on the team, and you're not on the team, nobody's on the God damn team. The team sucks!"


#55
nazacuckoo

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I would kill every person not already in the group I came in contact with. I would not greet them, in fact, the less they see my group or me, the better. Shooting them in the back is the best way. Never let them see you.  

 

World's best DayZ player right here^

Real life though? STAY AWAY FROM ME!!! Please? 


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"There's no "I" in team" 

"Yeah, there's no "U" either. So I guess if I'm not on the team, and you're not on the team, nobody's on the God damn team. The team sucks!"


#56
Jamber

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the "kill everyone not in ur group" type personality imo prob wouldn't last too long, either they'd get killed of in the constant battles OR someone in their own group would take out the bloodthirsty one, just out of self preservation b/c won't skate thru constant battles without suffering losses and someone would get fed up with that ... i would, i'd def view such a "leader" as unhinged for the safety of myself and my fam if they survived, i'd take him out

 

and daryl saving that thief was more for carol's benefit then the kids ... carol's still in a dark place, that talk about ashes and stuff .. so he's trying to help her along


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#57
Andrew

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I'd not kill a stranger, if I was in the bigger group.

What I would do is to test their loyalty, like give them guns with some part missing, or give them guard duty and have a trusted person watch them secretly, or just talk about a plot against the team leader and see their reaction. If they pass all the tests, only then will newcomers be accepted.
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#58
Lioness

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I am not generally violent and I certainly don't think it would be smart to run around killing everyone you meet. But, if someone took my weapons, whether or not they were nice about it, I would probably drop them. Stealing someone's weapons in that situation is increasing their risk of death. Setting walkers on them on top of that cinches it for me. Noah would have been toast, I am afraid.


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Putting out fire with gasoline.

#59
Lurwalker

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My choice would be more along the Mercy line.  I think Carol is suffering her own PTSD and was a bit trigger happy and Daryl checked her as she needed it at that moment.  However, if he would have come up on them again and tried to rob them then I would've gone for the leg or the ass as she had the gun pointed at it.


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#60
StrollingDead

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Earthquake guy, I'm very glad y'all banded together. The human spirit is still pretty strong. But what happens when people start to get hungry and are dying from third world viruses and what not. Katrina. Them idiots were firing on the National Guard choppers bringing them supplies. When the rescue workers don't show, or are overwhelmed, and the federal government can't respond quickly or has more on their plate it will get ugly, fast.

Not true about Katrina- there was a lot of garbage on the media at the time, like the snipers, and  gang rapes and murders in the Superdome, all of which turned out to be bull.

 

The only people who threatened people as a group were the armed suburbanites who blocked refugees trying to cross a bridge to get out of New Orleans.

 

I guess it does prove your point in a way, though it wasn't the desperate people inside New Orleans who got ugly,  it was the privileged a-holes outside (any speculation about the races of the people involved in the various incidents and how this affected media coverage probably belongs eslsewhere).

 

As far as the question goes, kill him- taking away your weapons or supplies could be tantamount to a death sentence.

 

Especially if you are killing him to get back your stuff at the time, as opposed to inding him asleep later and taking it back before he wakes up.


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#61
Chinghis

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I might have fired a warning shot at him, see if he stops, which I bet he would. 


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#62
mosher

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I might have fired a warning shot at him, see if he stops, which I bet he would. 

She did shoot, and he didn't stop.

 

 

It was so very clear to me that he was good people, my reasoning has been outlined above somewhere. But he was no coward. Not remotely a murderer and its extreme to say it was a death sentence when he left them both armed and capable with easy walkers to kill. Not much of a thief because any real thief would incapacitate them. But he was no coward. She shot at him and he didn't stop. He wouldn't have been able to tell that she was trying to hit him and Daryl waved it off. As far as he could have known it was a warning shot.


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#63
DominusPisces

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She did shoot, and he didn't stop.

 

 

It was so very clear to me that he was good people, my reasoning has been outlined above somewhere. But he was no coward. Not remotely a murderer and its extreme to say it was a death sentence when he left them both armed and capable with easy walkers to kill. Not much of a thief because any real thief would incapacitate them. But he was no coward. She shot at him and he didn't stop. He wouldn't have been able to tell that she was trying to hit him and Daryl waved it off. As far as he could have known it was a warning shot.

 

Or her aim was off, or she was using it to kill the walkers. Noah had NO reason to stay at that point. 


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Now I lay me down to sleep, I pray thee Lord these bites aren't deep.
Should I die before I wake, I pray thee Lord, my skull they break.


#64
I R Biter

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She did shoot, and he didn't stop.

 

 

It was so very clear to me that he was good people, my reasoning has been outlined above somewhere. But he was no coward. Not remotely a murderer and its extreme to say it was a death sentence when he left them both armed and capable with easy walkers to kill. Not much of a thief because any real thief would incapacitate them. But he was no coward. She shot at him and he didn't stop. He wouldn't have been able to tell that she was trying to hit him and Daryl waved it off. As far as he could have known it was a warning shot.

I got the impression the tent walkers were just meant to be an obstruction to help him get away, not really a death trap.  


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#65
mosher

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I got the impression the tent walkers were just meant to be an obstruction to help him get away, not really a death trap.  

I'm glad there are other people who didn't see that as a big deal. It was so clear he was just trying to get away, with zero intent to hurt anybody.


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#66
Serenity@sea

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I'm glad there are other people who didn't see that as a big deal. It was so clear he was just trying to get away, with zero intent to hurt anybody.

Yes, but anytime you are dealing with walkers, thing can and do go wrong.

When he threw that walker at Carol, she fell because she was injured. She would have died if Daryl hadn't intervened. Desperate people are dangerous. That's why Daryl almost let Noah die. He realized that he may be a scared young kid, but he was dangerous.

 

ETA: Throwing a walker at someone is showing some intent to do harm.


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#67
mosher

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Yes, but anytime you are dealing with walkers, thing can and do go wrong.

When he threw that walker at Carol, she fell because she was injured. She would have died if Daryl hadn't intervened. Desperate people are dangerous. That's why Daryl almost let Noah die. He realized that he may be a scared young kid, but he was dangerous.

That second time he was afraid for his life, it was different from his perspective. He had every reason to think they would kill him when they found him again. That's why I haven't made a comment about Daryl's behavior that time. That time what Noah did was absolutely extremely dangerous. That doesn't make Noah's character more suspect to me because logically he had to assume they would hurt him. It would have been a shame but if they had managed to drop Noah while he was running after that second event I don't think anyone would be second guessing. It would just be another sad but understandable moment.

 

I was talking about the first time, when he (in his mind, because he was not really thinking clearly) was in control of the situation. He came across to me as a good person that I would want with me. He's still alive, so I'd assumed he was resourceful. And he's still got an ethical leg to stand on, which is so rare. They wouldn't know he'd been mopping floors for the bulk of the apocalypse, they'd assume he'd been out in the world surviving. 

It's weird to me that know one suggested keeping him alive for information, though. He was in the city and could well have an idea about the hospital folk. 

 

Of course they are dangerous even in that first situation, but his priority was his mission and he very clearly wanted them to live. He could have shot them. This is deep into the apocalypse and the numbers he threw at them he could reasonably assume they've faced before. I'm not saying it was a nice move on Noah's part, I'm saying he did the least damage he could do which is pretty good evidence that he wanted the best for everyone. 


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#68
Lurwalker

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To StrollingDead.  I am wondering where you are from?  I lived in New Orleans area and lost everything during Katrina and I have to add that I personally know of people who were shot at and most certainly raped during the aftermath of Katrina (please refer to Charmange Neville from the famous Neville family singers who was raped at a local high school where she was seeking shelter from the hurricane and admitted this story on national tv).  Of additional note some of what the media revealed did actually happen including in the dome (yes rumors were given attention but not all were false). I have known a few that were shot at trying to get get out of the N.O. area as told directly to me from their own personal stories (certainly not second hand).


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#69
Singlyme

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I'm wondering if those of us giving Noah a pass do so because of our prior knowledge of him.  I abhor real-life violence, but Noah presented himself as a self-serving threat.  The actor stated on TTD that he was doing an "Otis" with D & C.   I'll admit I would have elected to go with Carol's gun to get the weapons back.  They were there to retrieve Beth, not fight through the streets of Atlanta with a hand gun and a couple of knives.


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#70
Nareen

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I think that Carol was right to try to take Noah down, to get their weapons back.  Daryl's action was probably more about pulling Carol back from the brink than about mercy but he was not wrong either, IMO.  

 

However, when Noah was helpless and about to be killed they did the right thing to rescue him.  For once karma worked for them.  I would not leave anyone to be devoured unless they were a direct and immediate threat.


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#71
Chryz707

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I think in this new world order so to speak, that its a kill or be killed world.  If you let someone take your weapons away and then you catch up with them, then they die!  I think they could maybe try to pry any information from the person before they die though, just to make sure they too arent going to stab me in the back.  its a crazy world in the Z Apocolypse!  There are no free rides!  Mistakes can get people killed in the end!


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#72
RYANINMICHIGAN

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so at what point in the apocolypse do you start shooting people on site? day 3? day 7? day 30? what if there is a cure? you just gunned down innocent people because....you got trigger happy?


The minute someone tries to take my stuff. That's when it's okay
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#73
DominusPisces

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The minute someone tries to take my stuff. That's when it's okay


Yeah. I would agree with that. Not just cause you stumbled on them.
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Now I lay me down to sleep, I pray thee Lord these bites aren't deep.
Should I die before I wake, I pray thee Lord, my skull they break.


#74
Chinghis

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She did shoot, and he didn't stop.

 

 

It was so very clear to me that he was good people, my reasoning has been outlined above somewhere. But he was no coward. Not remotely a murderer and its extreme to say it was a death sentence when he left them both armed and capable with easy walkers to kill. Not much of a thief because any real thief would incapacitate them. But he was no coward. She shot at him and he didn't stop. He wouldn't have been able to tell that she was trying to hit him and Daryl waved it off. As far as he could have known it was a warning shot.

I guess, I didn't think of her shot as a potential warning to him. A real warning shot, though, would kick up some dirt in front of him or hit a wall in front of him. And then you say something to let him know that the next one won't miss.


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