Episode 5: No Going Back Review ( And Season 2 Review Thread)

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#1
JesusMonroe

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Episode 5 is dropping on Steam in a few hours (I might not be able to play until Wednesday. Sigh...) so I thought I'd make the thread for the review. Considering people will be talking about Episode 5 as well as their thoughts on Season 2 as a whole, I just made it all one topic

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Imagine a group of a hundred motorcycles driving down a freeway. Eventually, they hit a junction. One road goes northwest and the other goes northeast. So one guy, we'll call him S, says, "Let's go northwest!" A mile past the intersection, a semi careens into the group and kills ninety of them. Ten are wounded, but they survive and keep going. Eventually, they hit 10,000 miles. S suddenly has his consciousness thrown into his past body right before the junction. Now, he says, "Let's go northeast!" All 100 bikers survive. Happily ever after, right? But what about the ten, no nine, who went northwest and survived? What happens to the reality they were living? Does it just disappear now that S has changed the past? It's not like only bad things happened on that 10,000 mile journey. Maybe one of them fell in love with a gas station attendant and got her pregnant or maybe one adopted a homeless kid that joined the adventure. That 10,000 mile journey would be full of stories. Romances, farewells, friendships...the loss of those ninety lives is horrible and unfortunate, but what would rewriting their history mean? The nine who survived lived full lives and did the best they could with the hand they were dealt. How could it be right to just erase all that? Isn't that worth something? Is there a point to a world where everything is happy? Are people who struggle for a better life just idiots? Being human is about fighting even when it seems hopeless and finding happiness in a world that hates it. Are you saying that's worthless?


#2
Macek11

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I start class tomorrow so I won't be able to play it until later in the day, I'm gonna be distracted all day thinking about it lol. Interested to see where we're going for season 3.
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#3
Gravelord

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Wow, just wow. Freaking incredible in possibly every sense. 


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Rudy5.png "Let the slaughter begin..."


#4
nazacuckoo

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Because I'm playing the 360 version I'll need to wait until tomorrow to play, so I'll be avoiding this topic until then.

However, I just want to post to say that I am so freaking excited for the finale.

I've loved season two so far, even though it has been a bit linear compared to season one. I really hope the finale is good...


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"There's no "I" in team" 

"Yeah, there's no "U" either. So I guess if I'm not on the team, and you're not on the team, nobody's on the God damn team. The team sucks!"


#5
GuidoP

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Okay that episode is just sick.. And I'm not sure yet if that's in a good way.. Just need to process everything first but maaaaan what an ending!


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#6
ThatEpicBeast U Know

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Okay that episode is just sick.. And I'm not sure yet if that's in a good way.. Just need to process everything first but maaaaan what an ending!

Which ending?  Spoiler tag, please...


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YouTube channel: https://www.youtube....suSrDxf3qF6z34w (Epic A)


#7
Neganite

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I don't think its available in the UK till Thursday so the next few days are going to be rough trying to avoid temptation to spoil it AGHHHH


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#8
GuidoP

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Which ending?  Spoiler tag, please...

Spoiler


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#9
That Guy

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Well that was depressing.

 

Spoiler

 

AJ for season 3.


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#10
ApexPredator

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Spoiler


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I can't believe you got him! You expert rooting-tooting, eagle-eyed, goth loving marksman! I love it. You managed to find a way to win. And everybody still loses!

#11
ThatEpicBeast U Know

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Spoiler


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YouTube channel: https://www.youtube....suSrDxf3qF6z34w (Epic A)


#12
JesusMonroe

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Amazing. I think I like this finale over Season 1's and it's the only Season 2 episode I like over Season 1. I'll give more thoughts later
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Imagine a group of a hundred motorcycles driving down a freeway. Eventually, they hit a junction. One road goes northwest and the other goes northeast. So one guy, we'll call him S, says, "Let's go northwest!" A mile past the intersection, a semi careens into the group and kills ninety of them. Ten are wounded, but they survive and keep going. Eventually, they hit 10,000 miles. S suddenly has his consciousness thrown into his past body right before the junction. Now, he says, "Let's go northeast!" All 100 bikers survive. Happily ever after, right? But what about the ten, no nine, who went northwest and survived? What happens to the reality they were living? Does it just disappear now that S has changed the past? It's not like only bad things happened on that 10,000 mile journey. Maybe one of them fell in love with a gas station attendant and got her pregnant or maybe one adopted a homeless kid that joined the adventure. That 10,000 mile journey would be full of stories. Romances, farewells, friendships...the loss of those ninety lives is horrible and unfortunate, but what would rewriting their history mean? The nine who survived lived full lives and did the best they could with the hand they were dealt. How could it be right to just erase all that? Isn't that worth something? Is there a point to a world where everything is happy? Are people who struggle for a better life just idiots? Being human is about fighting even when it seems hopeless and finding happiness in a world that hates it. Are you saying that's worthless?


#13
Deadpelican

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Well, it was   well- written and gripping.  It was a good finale. I'm  starting to feel like I've gotten my fill of the Walking Dead gaming universe though, for whatever reason.  I can't quite explain it. 

 

I'm glad that the    Russian thugs  were quickly bumped off.  

They were perhaps the most generic  Hollywood villains that I've seen in this series. 

It was smart not to linger on them for too long. 


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Shield yourself from those not bound to you by steel, for they are the blind. Aid them when you can, but lose not sight of yourself. 


#14
JesusMonroe

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So here are my thoughts on each of the endings

 

Shoot Kenny/Forgive Jane/Let the family In

Making the decision to shoot Kenny was a difficult one, but I just figured that even if he lived, the man had nothing left. He had absolutely nothing else to fight for in his life. He was pretty much an animal at that point and needed to be put down. His death is actually really sad in this one because he realized how terrible he's been lately and the fact that he doesn't want to die. This is, of course, before the revelation that the baby is actually alive. I see Clementine forgiving Jane more a decision out of Clementine's desperation to not be alone anymore. That also stems her decision to let the family in

 

Shoot Kenny/Forgive Jane/Don't Let the Family In

Clem gets a badass line. That's all there is to say. Though, I do like how Jane says, "Do you really wanna go through all of this again?" I don't, Jane. I really, really don't

 

Clementine Ends Up Alone

Clem not forgiving Jane/Kenny or killing both of them lead to this path. This one is kind of stupid, because a baby wouldn't not cry in a herd

 

Let Kenny Kill Jane/Enter Wellington

This one got to me quite a bit. Kenny's just been fighting for safety this entire time. He obviously values others but he decides to sacrifice companionship to keep Clementine and the baby safe. He's going to be alone for the rest of his life, but he can still smile thinking about how he kept Clementine safe. Also, his monologue to convince Clem to stay is really sad

 

Let Kenny Kill Jane/Leave With Kenny

I really like this one. Clem just decides it's not worth living if she can't be with who she cares about and I like to think that deep down, Kenny is glad that Clem decided to stay with him. He might miss Duck a lot, but Clementine gives him a reason to live

 

Anyway, what I can conclude from all these endings (besides one) is that Season 2 was not about Clementine, it was about Kenny. I never thought I'd like someone as much as Lee


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Imagine a group of a hundred motorcycles driving down a freeway. Eventually, they hit a junction. One road goes northwest and the other goes northeast. So one guy, we'll call him S, says, "Let's go northwest!" A mile past the intersection, a semi careens into the group and kills ninety of them. Ten are wounded, but they survive and keep going. Eventually, they hit 10,000 miles. S suddenly has his consciousness thrown into his past body right before the junction. Now, he says, "Let's go northeast!" All 100 bikers survive. Happily ever after, right? But what about the ten, no nine, who went northwest and survived? What happens to the reality they were living? Does it just disappear now that S has changed the past? It's not like only bad things happened on that 10,000 mile journey. Maybe one of them fell in love with a gas station attendant and got her pregnant or maybe one adopted a homeless kid that joined the adventure. That 10,000 mile journey would be full of stories. Romances, farewells, friendships...the loss of those ninety lives is horrible and unfortunate, but what would rewriting their history mean? The nine who survived lived full lives and did the best they could with the hand they were dealt. How could it be right to just erase all that? Isn't that worth something? Is there a point to a world where everything is happy? Are people who struggle for a better life just idiots? Being human is about fighting even when it seems hopeless and finding happiness in a world that hates it. Are you saying that's worthless?


#15
Deadpelican

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So Kenny can  survive huh? Interesting. 

 

I shot him because, in true fashion, I figured that the girl would kill him or walkers would get him if I didn't.  That's how its worked so far. 

 

But I would have shot Kenny anyway. 

He was so far past the point of reason and I thought he'd become dangerous to himself and others.  


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Shield yourself from those not bound to you by steel, for they are the blind. Aid them when you can, but lose not sight of yourself. 


#16
JesusMonroe

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He was so far past the point of reason and I thought he'd become dangerous to himself and others.

Maybe in other situations but I think Kenny was in the right at the end. He saw AJ as his own and Jane admitted to killing it. Most fathers don't take kindly to their children getting killed, even if it's an accident. It's Mama Bear and her cubs

Jane provoked Kenny into killing her to prove a point. They're both in the wrong, but Jane is more wrong and stupid. She poked the bear and got killed for it

Kenny's still an asshole, though

Well, it was well- written and gripping. It was a good finale. I'm starting to feel like I've gotten my fill of the Walking Dead gaming universe though, for whatever reason. I can't quite explain it

Maybe because you're getting sick of the "Introduce group-->Arbitrary choices that change deaths for some characters-->Massacre-->Introduce new characters since group is getting small-->Everybody but Clementine is dead. She is now facing an uncertain future. Statuses of some characters are unknown" formula?

I was worried about it going into Season 2. Sigh...
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Imagine a group of a hundred motorcycles driving down a freeway. Eventually, they hit a junction. One road goes northwest and the other goes northeast. So one guy, we'll call him S, says, "Let's go northwest!" A mile past the intersection, a semi careens into the group and kills ninety of them. Ten are wounded, but they survive and keep going. Eventually, they hit 10,000 miles. S suddenly has his consciousness thrown into his past body right before the junction. Now, he says, "Let's go northeast!" All 100 bikers survive. Happily ever after, right? But what about the ten, no nine, who went northwest and survived? What happens to the reality they were living? Does it just disappear now that S has changed the past? It's not like only bad things happened on that 10,000 mile journey. Maybe one of them fell in love with a gas station attendant and got her pregnant or maybe one adopted a homeless kid that joined the adventure. That 10,000 mile journey would be full of stories. Romances, farewells, friendships...the loss of those ninety lives is horrible and unfortunate, but what would rewriting their history mean? The nine who survived lived full lives and did the best they could with the hand they were dealt. How could it be right to just erase all that? Isn't that worth something? Is there a point to a world where everything is happy? Are people who struggle for a better life just idiots? Being human is about fighting even when it seems hopeless and finding happiness in a world that hates it. Are you saying that's worthless?


#17
Deadpelican

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Maybe in other situations but I think Kenny was in the right at the end. He saw AJ as his own and Jane admitted to killing it.  
 

 

I guess I wasn't paying close enough attention. My impression was that she led him to believe the baby was killed by walkers, not that she did it herself. 

 

But I'll take your word for it because I don't plan to play it again anytime soon. 

 

 

Maybe because you're getting sick of the "Introduce group-->Arbitrary choices that change deaths for some characters-->Massacre-->Introduce new characters since group is getting small-->Everybody but Clementine is dead. She is now facing an uncertain future. Statuses of some characters are unknown" formula?

 

 

 

Yes, and the fact that this game world doesn't seem to have many more possibilities beyond what you've just described. 

 

So yeah there's a formula, but what else can they do really? 


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Shield yourself from those not bound to you by steel, for they are the blind. Aid them when you can, but lose not sight of yourself. 


#18
slimymeteor

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Damn, no bonus scene after the credits... but I guess that's the trade-off for having multiple endings.  I loved that there was such an extremely difficult choice for me to make that really did end up mattering in a big way, and I still don't know if I made the right choice or not.  This episode had what the other episodes of the season were missing.

 

My favorite part of the episode was seeing Lee.  I was so excited to see him again, even if it was just a dream.  It brought tears to my eyes. 

 

That, and my ending in which I shot Kenny, were very emotional for me.  I sided with Kenny for the entire season every time someone badmouthed him, and I fully intended to stay with him.  However, I thought the baby was dead, and Kenny was trying to shove a knife into Jane's heart right in front of me.  I loved him, but I just couldn't let him do that.  When he told me I made the right decision, I choked up.  And when he pointed out how he was so close to making it to Wellington, after all that shit, that was it for me.  Everything that guy's done and been through, and wouldn't it have been nice for him to just see one of his fucking plans work out?

 

I felt like I made the right choice after hearing Kenny's talk, with his reassurance that I did what was right.  But then when I realized the baby was alive and it was all a ruse, then I felt like it was the wrong choice.  So Jane's plan was to provoke Kenny into attacking her, so she could kill him in self defense and get away with Clem and the baby?  I forgave Jane, just because I knew she really did care about Clem and probably had better intentions even if they were very misguided.  I also didn't see the logic in leaving Clem alone with the baby out in the dead of winter, even if I was pissed at Jane.  Shit happens in the ZA, I guess, and we needed Jane.

 

But even when I arrived back at Howe's with Jane, I started feeling like, "Ugh, I don't wanna be back here.  I wish I was going to Wellington with Kenny."  I started feeling more regret over my decision.  I chose to let the family in, even though it's dangerous.  You've gotta take the chance, because you need people to survive.  You're pretty limited when your group only consists of one able-bodied adult, a child and a newborn.  I was leery of them, but I figured we just got back and hadn't put any work into fortifying the place again, so if they wanted to take it, then fuck it, let 'em have it.

 

I like Jane, but goddamn I regret shooting Kenny so much.  If the choice were presented any other way, and the two of them ordered me to either choose one or the other to go with, it'd be Kenny all the way.  But I just couldn't let Jane die like that.

 

EDIT: Oh, and FUCK Bonnie and Mike, and that piece of shit Arvo.


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#19
thelastpaul

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Well, I ended up alone.  Fuck. 

 

The situation with Kenny and Jane was insane. Bottom line I didn't feel she deserved to die, and Kenny was out of control. Coupled with his history and their huge fight in the car, I knew he would end up killing her so I shot him.   He said I made the right decision, which punched me right in the gut.  Tears welled up as I said good-bye to my dear, anger prone friend. He went out on a hilarious line by the way, as only poor Kenny could.

 

When I found out that Jane had purposefully done all this shit and that the baby was alive and fine I left her. 

 

That was absolutely insane and completely inappropriate of her given the high stress and high danger environment that they were all in. Completely irresponsible, could have resulted in all of their deaths. Fucking dumb.  So I left her. Bit of an emotional response, but honestly? Fuck it.  The way I saw it is all I had left (As Clementine) was respect for all of the good people who died helping me along the way. None of them would have ever purposefully done what Jane did to one of the group.   Yes, the group. Despite how out of control Kenny was getting, I still don't think he was lost (until that point where he tried to murder her). Still don't think that this all needed to be forced right then at that very moment. 

 

Someone who can't handle a high pressure situation correctly, or even worse... starts instigating shit at the very worst possible time in the world, is a danger to me in the end.  If I want to survive, I need to get away from that danger, no matter how helpful it might presently seem.

 

I got by far the shittiest outcome of the choices.

 

Also, I hate to say it because it would be brutal and terrible to live in a world like this, but where was the option to just leave the baby behind with Jane? Sorry.. but if I've already been making all these insane decisions and shit.. fact of the matter is I wouldn't choose to haul a very low chance of surviving, zombie attention getting machine around with me. Yes I know I'm leaving in the first place because Jane is a huge liability and what not, but if it's a choice between the roadside or Jane, despite her being a crazy bitch the baby would still have a shot with her (if she chose to not abandon the baby as well, in which case either way...).

 

Also, poor Luke.   Poor, poor Luke. That really sucked ass watching him die. Really, really badly.   This whole episode just punches you in the gut over and over and over again.   


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#20
Macek11

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Great great episode. Every choice was pretty hard.. I just couldn't shoot Kenny, and I left Wellington with him. Was hoping Lilly would come out of nowhere as the leader maybe and say we could all stay.. But in the end I'm surprised Kenny didn't react more strongly to Clem not wanting to go to Wellington. He almost seemed glad that Clem decided to stay with him.. I just couldn't leave him.. ride or die 4 life son.
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#21
albert_otrp

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I chose to let Jane get stabbed based on the following reasonings: 1.) What Jane did was entrapment. You cannot call a guy crazy by driving him that way. She could have told Kenny that the baby was alive, but she made it appear that she abandoned it. You just don't mess around with people like that. 2.) She pulled a knife on Kenny, from a fist fight it turned into a knife fight, we can argue now that Kenny killed her out of self defense. 3.) Survival of the fittest. Kenny would have won fair and square without Clem's intervention. It reminds me a bit of A Song of Ice and Fire (Game of Thrones)'s concept of "trial by combat", wherein a persons guilt or innocence is determined by his/her passion in defending him/herself in mortal combat..


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#22
nazacuckoo

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Ouch. This episode made me feel miserable, angry and very... VERY guilty.

But I loved every freaking last second of it. Awesome. This is definitely the best episode of the entire series... At least to me.

 

First off, the scene where everyone was drinking rum around a fire was great. Made me feel happy before the episode decided to give me a gut punch.

I shot the walkers coming after Luke. I thought I'd collapse the ice if I tried to help me. Then he died. Fuck. Luke was a really cool guy, and looking at his dead face was one of the most disturbing things ever. Bonnie survived. I was an ass to Arvo most of the time, but I felt really bad when Mike told me that he deserved to be treated like a human being. And damn, Mike and bonnie trying to leave all of a sudden... With Arvo of all people! I still think they're cool characters, but damn...

Then I was in the car with Jane and Kenny. Awesome. Jane is my favourite character, and Kenny is really close behind.

Of course, then shit happened. When the time came to decide Kenny's fate, I really almost shot him. I can't believe that. I never would have thought it.

However, I let him kill Jane. Not sure why. Anyways, I decided not to leave Kenny alone, I couldn't do that after everything that has happened to him.

 

Finally, I just want to say that Kenny is the most badass fictional anti-hero ever. Even better than Walter White. Yeah, I said it.

I loved the ending I got. I don't tend to be emotional over video games or movies, but this made me shed some man-tears.

Damn.


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"There's no "I" in team" 

"Yeah, there's no "U" either. So I guess if I'm not on the team, and you're not on the team, nobody's on the God damn team. The team sucks!"


#23
Agent Piltdown

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Telltale really outdid themselves with this finale, the range of endings you could of gotten. I only think it could top the Season 1 finale if Kenny's death is as emotional as Lee's, but I haven't had the guts to try that out yet... Still I'm more than satisfied with the ending I got.

 

I let Kenny kill Jane, and refused to leave him on his own and left Wellington with him and AJ. I was surprised this was an actual option, and a hopeful one at that? Walking Dead suddenly became True Grit with that ending. I was seeing Rooster Cogburn when Kenny said Clem was "as stubborn as a mule", that was awesome. :D

 

The biggest emotional hit for my playthrough was when Luke died. It managed to surprise me, everything up until that point seemed to be leading towards some sort of final confrontation between him and Kenny, like I could see the cogs turning underneath the game and the mechanism leading Luke to that point, but Telltale pulled off a true Walking Dead shock twist with that abrupt death and managed to get to me. So good on them for that, I guess. *long sigh* :(

 

The confrontation fell to Jane and Kenny, but I actually managed to pick up that something was amiss. As soon as Jane returned alone I said "He'll kill her", but when Jane calmly explained what was about to happen I knew she was holding something back. I think even Jane would of been stricken if AJ really died, so my priority in the fight was to try to stop them coming to blows but I knew where I stood from the off and didn't hesitate much in the end.

 

For Jane's sake, what a waste, but it was in keeping with her character and a good twist. I liked her alot, but for my 'primary' save I still feel I made the right choice. She should have had faith that Clem knew Kenny well enough that he wouldn't hurt anyone for his own sadistic pleasure, only to protect those he was with. He's a hothead and an asshole sometimes, but in the end, he wasn't completely wrong, was he?

 

When it came to Arvo, I had no sympathy for the lad given all the trouble he caused and the evil glares he was giving Clem showed he had malicious intent, so when Kenny was bullying him I was glad someone wasn't going to let him get revenge so easily. Beating him down to the floor was wrong, but Mike reacted too much like a bleeding heart taking the supplies to leave with him to get him away from Kenny. I think in the end Kenny could of been calmed down enough to leave him behind unbound with some supplies. Kenny was getting too intense at times and I could understand why the others were scared, but they overreacted.

 

So in the end I stuck with Kenny much like I did with Lee. He hated Lee's guts for not killing Larry but more often than not Lee had his back and so did Clem. Plus he has the most powerful stache. One of the greats.

 

By the way guys, if you haven't seen the trailer, watch it until the very end, there's a great sequence showing Clem before the Apocalypse with Sandra the babysitter and her parents on the phone.

 

 

After watching it I reflected on how much we have seen her character grow in the game so far as I'm sure was the intent. She's an amazing character. I wonder what the future holds in store for her now? I get the impression we'll see her again but not as the main character, but her attitude will be shaped significantly depending on what ending you got.

 

And... whew, sorry for the long post, but it felt good to express my thought like that, heh.


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#24
deadhead216

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So I just finished and wow. Overall great episode I was left angry and sad. First off fuck arvo. Bonnie and mike pissed me off too with the crap they pulled. I was sad to have to do it but I put Kenny down I felt it was a nod to s1 with Lee going. I'm just curious to see how it's going to go with Jane and these new folks
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#25
SuperNeos2

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I couldn't put Kenny down. I feel like he was right in the Jane situation since she admitted to killing the baby and even if it apparently was an accident, no one would take kindly to this and remain calm. And when it was revealed that AJ was alive and remembering how calm Jane was explaining things to me when Kenny went out for those few seconds to look for him, I put the pieces together that she set this up to have Kenny lose his shit and give her a reason to kill him.

It was then I knew I made the right choice.

After everything that's happened between us, I couldn't abandon Kenny for Wellington due to the bond that we shared since Hershel's Farm. I don't know these people and Kenny's my friend. It was either all of us or none of us and even though Kenny can be an asshole, just the sacrifice he was willing to make to allow the kids to stay touched me. It shows that he's still a good guy.

Even though Kenny might be a little disappointed that I didn't take safety, I know he's really happy I decided to stay with him and not leave him alone in this world. It's us and AJ against the world and I'm really happy I got this ending.
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