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Posted Yelnots on 01 April 2013 - 02:42 AM
That's my review
Posted Leela on 01 April 2013 - 02:25 AM
They treated her like shit all season, and then this is what we get in the end? Merle gets to die a hero, but Andrea, one of the pillars of the Walking Dead, gets treated like a freaking piece of meat in the end.
I’m so fucking LIVID.
Posted Leela on 25 February 2013 - 12:58 PM
In the comics, Woodbury wasn't a town. I mean, it was literally, but in the comics Woodbury was just an alliteration for The Governor. Woodbury was that town where the Governor lived and it was NEVER focused on. Woodbury was just the enemy and we never had to deal with any of its stupid residents, save for a few cronies here and there. We saw the Woodbury army attacking the prison twice, we saw the zombie arena, but that was it. There was practically no Woodbury in the comics and that worked, because you always got the feeling the Prison was fighting this mythical enemy. The group never knew what they were up against, they didn't know how big Woodbury was, the people in it. Robert Kirkman keeping Woodbury away in the dark made things so much more exciting, because the audience didn't know what the prison was up against. It was just like, "well, Woodbury could be 10 people, or it could be 100 people, or 1,000 people." We never knew what Woodbury was hiding, and that made it all the more exciting and intriguing.
And it also gave Kirkman a chance to finally TRULY develop ALL the characters and bring them to their true selves.
Woodbury doesn't work on the show because the show has tried to humanize Woodbury and I'm sorry, I don't care about Woodbury's humanization. I don't care about Milton, Karen, Haley, Tom (or whatever the asthma kid's name was). These people are just wasting my time. I feel like the writers just use them as filler. Don't give me Milton if you're not going to develop him and he's just gonna say some lines here and there.
It's kind of ironic that the ONLY Comic Woodbury resident that actually mattered and became important to the prison, Alice, was never introduced to the show. Having Alice would be SO MUCH better than having to deal with the constant stream of Woodbury residents that no one gives a shit about.
Woodbury feels like a cop out, like Mazzara just didn't have enough material for the prison, so he needed to introduce this other universe to fill in the gaps. I can just picture the writer's room:
Writer 1: Oh, shit, guys. Why is Merle at the prison? Why would the prison accept Merle? I feel like we should explore this.
Writer 2: We still have 18 minutes to cover.
Mazzara: Hmmm.... Well, Merle needs to be at the prison because of reasons.
Writer 1: .... Glen, it just doesn't make any sense that--
Mazzara: Just cut to a Woodbury resident.
Writer 3: What?
Writer 2: Who?
Mazzara: That one... with the dark hair.
Writer 1: ... Who are we talking about?
Writer 3: You mean Penny?
Writer 4: Dude, Penny's a walker.
Writer 2: Glen, we killed Haley and we can't give Martinez any humanity because character depth is just not our thing, remember?
Mazzara: Hmm. Okay, easy. Just give Karen some lines.
Writer 1: ...What?
Writer 2: Who the fuck is Karen?
Writer 3: Don't you mean Haley?
Writer 1: No, we just killed Haley.
Writer 4: Who the fuck is Haley? We have a character named Haley?
Mazzara: Just give some lines to Karen.
Writer 2: Glen... who's Karen?
Mazzara: She's in Woodbury, okay? She's just like... a girl in Woodbury. Do I have to do all the thinking?
Writer 1: ...
Writer 2: ...
Writer 3: ...
Writer 4: ...Glen, can you just explain what it is you want us to do?
Mazzara: LOL look guys. I got a rubber pencil going on here.
Posted xaviersaint on 25 November 2012 - 08:20 PM
I am asking everyone to keep that talk classy, upscale and not act like little juvenile horn dogs with bullshit of "Haha I'd let <insert character> rape me all day long" comments. It's not a joking subject. Don't turn these threads or discussions into that. It's one thing to say "I support the Governor's decision to have Maggie with no shirt." but another to go into details of how they could film the scene or how they could make it so it could be pleasurable to watch.
I and the rest of the forum staff have all ready warned and temporarily suspended posting privileges of those idiots and if they return and continue to be idiots, my boot will show them the door out the forum. And rest assured, that same boot will gladly show you the same door they went out if you decide to act like them.
We must be respectful of everyone here. And I've all ready been approached by victims of that crime that post here about what has been posted previously. Please be smarter then a junior high school student when we broach this or any other sensitive subject like that.
Thank you. You may resume your postings.
Posted TheLibrarian on 20 February 2012 - 06:21 AM
This is basically a summary of what is destined to be pretty long so read this draft at your own risk. Within these paragraphs I am going to try to offer to the best of my ability an objective look at the relationship between the Characters of Daryl Dixon and Carol Peletier
Season 1 – Episode 4 – Vatos
Scene: Daryl vs Reality vs The Group
Rick, Glenn, Shane, T-Dog, Lori and Andrea are discussing whether or not it would be the correct thing to go back to get Merle, after Daryl's outburst asking them why'd they leave his brother on top of the roof of an apartment store.
Daryl is surprised that Rick, T-Dog, and Glenn offer to go help his brother. After all, why would they do something so selfless for a prick that threatened the entire group? Daryl doesn't see why anyone would help out of their own self interests and then begins to realize that his way of thinking may not be the best.
Season 2 – Episode 5 – Chupacabra
Scene: Daryl hallucinates, self reflects, and denounces Merle
I think that Daryl let Merle influence him greatly before the apocalypse. We see in the episode Chupacabra that he has a hallucination of his brother and that Merle taught him that he was useless. Merle taught him that he was the only one would ever care for him. That he was an outcast and that Merle was his only option. Daryl left to his own devices would have stayed with Merle and become more greatly brainwashed by his brothers racism, sexism and general ugliness. The apocalypse was the catalyst that Daryl needed to set him on the right path and I personally believe that if Daryl kept Merle by his side any longer that his evolution would become almost non-existent.
Understand that this is my opinion and I have absolutely no hard feelings when people disagree with me. I just try to be objective and unbiased in my views and do not let the fact that I really like Daryl blur the lines on what he would have been like in the past.
Season 2 – Episode 9 – Trigger-finger
Scene: Carol “Checks up” on Daryl, Daryl Lashes Out.
A lot of people are going to think that Daryl was too harsh in this scene. It's true. Yet, on the other hand I do not take that to mean that he was being unfair or that he was incorrect in his assessment, nor do I agree that it is proof of him showing contempt for Carol. He was speaking bluntly and I wish that more people would do that instead of always beating around the bush.
But onto the topic herein: I did not interpret his anger as an bad thing either. In fact, I found that it was a necessary confrontation between these two characters and in the end this scene was ultimately a good thing for their evolving friendship.
Consider what we know about Daryl so far. – He's been closeted his entire life and does not know how to properly deal with or show his emotions. Therefore, I I ask, do you think that Daryl would have been so personal with anyone else in the same manner that he had displayed with Carol? Even if it was out of anger?
Sure he's made quite the tempered remark to Shane and to Rick in the first season but he's never had never quite the depth to these little tantrums as recently displayed. Here Daryl is speaking from his heart and he is letting Carol know how he feels, and that's a tough thing for him to do. Especially considering the way that he was brought up under Merle's tyranny and his fathers abandonment. You can bet he is hurting.
I personally believe that it's obvious that he cares for Carol in some way maybe not romantically but in some way more than just mutual understanding, or he wouldn't even have given her the time of day in such a manner. He would not have wasted his strength calling out a woman that does not mean a thing to him. I know that I wouldn't!
But yes of course he is angry at her and that is completely understandable. Still, I am pretty confident that he is just as angry at himself for not being able to save Sophia and that he recognizes that Carol has had similar hardships that he has had and that he is reflecting his own pain onto her just as much as he is calling out her flaws.
Maybe I am wrong but I quite honestly feel that this outburst was needed to let the tension between them collapse. Did you notice that sly smile they had at each other? That after their scene Daryl dressed up? Letting your feelings be known helps you out more often than not, it makes one know where you stand and I think that Daryl finally did that. It's as if a layer of blurry film has been lifted and we can finally see what lies beneath in its unfiltered form. Or to quote a more exaggerated cliché, it was like a breath of fresh air.
In conclusion it is my opinion that I have to say that the most likely route I see for these two in the future is that they continue their evolutions and continue to explore their faults and their weaknesses until it becomes clear that their bonding has just made them become stronger. When all the bull is finally out of the way and the flimsy shade is dropped, there will be a more clear view.
Bonus: It could also be said that Daryl feels some sort of relationship with Andrea, according to the scene in which he reveals that he was once left alone as a child, yet this also occurs while discussing Sophia, which ultimately directly links his conversation back to Carol and their abusive pasts.
Posted Ansceniiiic on 27 February 2013 - 02:44 AM
Posted ZombieFangirl on 06 March 2012 - 06:02 AM
I keep reading post after post about how Dale deserved to die, or he should have been dead a long time ago, or that people like him aren't meant for this whole zombie apocalypse thing. Lori should die too, because hey, all she does is cook and do laundry. And Carol! My God, all she does is cry over her dead daughter! What a waste!
Everyone can't be a Rick, or a Shane, or a Daryl. Everyone can't be some zombie killing badass with an ear necklace.
Would the show really be that interesting if everyone had the same thoughts and the same mindset? If everyone was a badass? I personally don't want to see 10 versions of the same character.
I have a feeling that should there ever be a real zombie apocalypse, there will be quite a few Dales and Loris, and Carols.
And if you are a Shane... maybe try to be somewhat thankful that Carol washed your nasty ass shorts and Lori made your dinner.
Posted Ansceniiiic on 07 March 2013 - 10:13 PM
Posted d2daybreak on 26 November 2012 - 05:18 AM
Posted Leela on 14 November 2012 - 12:37 AM
They also seem obsessed with the idea that for Andrea to be someone, she needs make mistakes first so she can learn her Very Important Lesson. Every time she wants to grow, they shove her back. She wanted to be a better sister, they kill Amy. She wanted to learn to shoot, make her shoot Daryl. She was finally mending her relationship with Dale, kill Dale (I know this were outside circumstances and nothing to do with Andrea). She finally has a BFF, no, shut it down. She wants to believe in the resurface of civilization and wants to live in a loving community? Make her a psychopath's next victim and the community a nightmare.
When in reality, people go on journeys all the time and you don't learn from mistakes all the time. Sometimes you just learn things as you go along. But they don't really seem to get this. Everything's a lesson. Everything's about stripping her down so she can rise up again. It's getting really repetitive and therefore, annoying.
I like Andrea, precisely because she's so flawed, naive, daft, etc. I like her complexity. I don't want perfect people on my television, it's why I grew bored with Daryl. And I get what the writers are doing. The problem is, they don't know HOW to do it. They keep writing the same thing for her, every season. Andrea sets her eyes on something. Let's shit on her. Let's see her dig herself out of it. First Amy. Then the gun. Now Woodbury. Next season: Andrea wants to be a lumberjack. Oh no, she drops a tree on the baby! Now she must learn a very important lesson about lumbering safety. What have you learned now, Andrea? That's right. You always leave a note.
And it's not just Andrea. They do it to Glenn, too. I rolled my eyes so hard last week when he shouted loudly and attracted a bunch of walkers. Really, like, at this point you'd think he would've learned not to be such a doof. Every season he must "grow" and "become a man" and protect what's his. I get it already! They treat Andrea and Glenn like they're babies.
TV Andrea is like Charlie Brown, Comic Andrea is the football, and the writers are that bitch Lucy. And I'm just sitting here yelling at the TV, "just let her kick the fucking ball for once!!
Posted Creeper on 22 October 2012 - 03:39 AM
I agree. I actually thought Rick was trying with Lori this episode..he didn't have to go after her at the end, and I felt like him putting his hand on her shoulder was actually a "big step" for him. If he had spoken his thoughts right then, he might have said "this is the best I can do right now." And I didn't take Lori's tears and leaning into where he had just touched as being disappointed at his coldness..I took it as relishing the tiny bit of connection she had got(which further proves how cold things have been between them and for how long, if she relishes him touching her shoulder) and being a mixture of grateful and self-loathing over getting herself in this position.
I think they are doing a good job redeeming her. I know quite a few people don't agree. I hope she doesn't throw her life away because she thinks she is worth nothing. Even though I was pretty sure it wouldn't go down that way, I was still horrified at her giving mouth to mouth..that is the way to make yet another lipless zombie!
I found this episode to be nice combination of lots of tension and emotion. I got tear-eyed twice, the first time while Maggie was talking to her Dad...ugh.. and the second time was the Rick and Lori moment. I tell ya, if and when they finally actually reconcile and embrace, I'm going to have a major cathartic moment! I can't believe how emotionally attached I am to these characters, just thinking about it makes my eyes water...
Rick's characterization is amazing this season. AL is an awesome actor! You know Rick is truly a changed man when Daryl is the gentle, tenderhearted out of the two!
Loving this season!
Posted backwoodsroamer on 07 October 2012 - 12:01 AM
Posted Mrs. DD on 03 May 2013 - 02:26 AM
Posted 'Rick' Duff on 01 April 2013 - 02:18 AM
Posted TheHarshTruth on 25 March 2013 - 08:05 PM
Merle has always been a "bad seed" living a life of self-destruction beginning from when he was a child growing up abused. He's grown up afraid all his life - and his only escape was to run. Just as he ran from home. (Remember how Daryl felt his brother abandoned him?) Fear caused him to run, and fear caused him to escape through drug use, and anti-social behavior (running away from any possibility of closeness). Fear has ALWAYS consumed Merle.
After the ZA, long after the child abuse, new fear consumes Merle. Walkers...TG....becoming one of "them".....he's afraid of them all.
Rick has his "Do you know why you do what you do/decisions you make" conversation with him. The answer (though Merle doesn't have that epiphony yet: FEAR.)
Carol has her "late bloomer" conversation with him. Merle notices how different Carol is now. Carol admits she used to be meek and weak because of her fear of her husband. Merle says "You aren't afraid of anything now, huh?"..."Nope" says Carol. Merle admires and desires this freedom from fear Carol has found. The epiphony STILL doesn't hit yet.
Later with Michonne...as she's trying to get in his head she successfully hits home with her "Bad guys aren't afraid" speech. Merle finally puts the pieces together. BOOM. Epiphony hits and he cuts Michonne loose. He killed for the Governor because he was afraid. He ran because he was afraid. He took Michonne because he was afraid. Finally he realizes....his fear is controlling him. He then decides to take matters in his own hands and conquer his fears. No more running. No more fear.
Even in the final moments, as he waited for death from TG, he defiantly yells "I'm not going to beg you!". He showed he overcame his fear. His fear of death, TG, of everything....Merle has indeed become a late bloomer - and finally free of the shackles of fear that consumed his own life. For his last moments, he is his own man...and not someone's whipping boy.
Posted Sonaliegh on 18 February 2013 - 05:47 AM
1) I love how the discussion between Daryl and Merle re: returning to the prison goes nowhere. Merle points out that they can't go back because they'll never let him in. This makes total and complete sense. Daryl has no answer for that but just keeps arguing for it, because nobody could think up more sensical dialogue.
2) There is literally no reason for Maggie to be upset at Glenn other than that the writers think it adds some sort of dramatic tension. What, is Glenn going to go in there, talk to her, get the answers he needs and walk away satisfied? Fuck that, we can't film that. Have her push him away.
3) Is Daryl Merle's little brother? I can't tell, it isn't mentioned quite enough.
Actually there is a reason for Maggie to be mad at Glenn. He's acting like a dick. Ever since they escaped Woodbury he's been on 10. Dude can't see straight. He's obsessed with what happened to her. She told him before that the Gov. didn't rape her yet he kept pushing the issue. When they were on the road back he kept inferring to Rick and Daryl that the Gov. had to pay for what he did to Maggie. I don't think she likes how he's using her as an excuse to go off the handle. Granted Rick's going crazy but Glenn is blinded by rage. It's irritating. If I was in Maggie's position I wouldn't want someone constantly throwing that in my face either. It's annoying as hell.
Posted backwoodsroamer on 01 April 2013 - 03:56 AM
Way back almost thirty years ago I was a police officer. That was back before a kinder gentler America and before lawsuits were the norm. The tactical wisdom in those days when someone had a weapon was to tell them to drop it. You told them once. If they didn't comply you shot them immediately. You didn't ask them again, you didn't negotiate, you didn't shoot to wound, or fire a warning shot. You just shot them. Anything else was just giving them time to think about what they were going to do.
When someone takes up arms against you for whatever reason you don't owe them anything. You don't owe them a fair fight, because there is no such thing. You don't give them the luxury thinking up a new plan on your time. As Carl pointed out the enemy you let live today may kill you tomorrow. Anytime you take up arms in a confrontation you should be ready to kill or be killed. If you're not willing for either to happen, you really shouldn't be playing in that league.
You can also just look at it as two scared kids, each with a gun. It's not hard to see a bad ending coming for somebody. As they say "s##t happens." Bad s##t most of the time.
As I said, I can see no fault with Carl's actions or his reasoning as he told Rick. He was a bit rude with his father which I would speak to him about later were I Rick. Apart from that, I've got no problems with the kid.
Posted bulby37 on 01 April 2013 - 03:11 AM
Posted Boone on 14 March 2013 - 08:41 PM
Posted Koibito on 11 March 2013 - 07:58 PM
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